r/HonestHotTakes • u/Misterlee777 • 11h ago
casual hot take Men should raise their standards
A lot of men will complain that women standards are too high or unrealistic and they may be some truth to that but at the same time complaining won’t change anything so men should instead raise their standards and require more of women so the playing field will be more equal.
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u/thegabster2000 10h ago
Many men do have high standards. They don't have high standards for getting laid.
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u/Vertigo50 9h ago
This is the answer. Women assume men have low standards because men are still dating low-quality women.
Women tend to filter out a lot of men and only date the ones who meet their standards.
Men will "have fun" with women who don't meet their standards for being a long-term partner while they wait for something better to come along.
Moral of the story: Just because he's sleeping with you, doesn't mean you meet his standards. Sorry. 🤷♂️
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u/Gullible-Chapter-800 10h ago
Why are we acting like men as a whole and women as a whole have the same standards? Lol. There’s plenty of both with low standards
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u/okbrat00111011 11h ago
Men should stop ingesting red pill content because it’s made to keep them alone and bitter.
A lot of men who are having trouble have rotten personalities where it’s obvious they have a disdain for women. Many women would rather be single than with a miserable man and some men can’t fathom that.
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u/Waste-Menu-1910 11h ago
Red pill content falls apart very quickly the moment someone engages with reality. I have yet to meet a person who stuck with red pill bullshit very long.
A guy who was massively hurt may start down that path, but it becomes such a parody of itself so quickly that I never saw anyone stay there.
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u/goblin_jade 10h ago
I know someone who has been riding the manosphere for 10+ years. But he also has developmental problems that have left his brain permanently at 12 or 13, even though he's in his 30s.
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u/Waste-Menu-1910 10h ago
Honest question for you. How isolated is he? I can understand a little bit of time, such as after a bad breakup, or as an unsuccessful awkward teen, but in 10 years he managed to avoid evidence that it's a grift? I'm honestly and in good faith curious about how.
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u/goblin_jade 10h ago
He, because of his developmental condition, is on disability. He stays on social media, MMOs and his father used to be something of a playboy that used women for sex before getting clean and sober. His father is convinced that his wife is the only good, upstanding woman left in the world and so is he. The only person's opinion this kid values (he is mentally like 12 or 13) is his father's as well. Neither one of them have left the house except to go fishing in probably 15 years.
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u/DrainTheMuck 5h ago
Yeah, I fell into it for a while and part of what woke me up was moving to a new environment where I saw the reality that people of all shapes and sizes have partners, not just the “chads”. There are a few concepts that still kinda ring true, like my not “taking charge” enough with the last girl I dated seemed to be a major reason she called it off, and it sucks getting reinforcement that being a “nice guy” works against you, but I’ve been trying to find a healthier lens to work on that through.
I’m talking about stuff like I asked for verbal consent before making a sexual advance and she said no, and then later on told me she wishes I just went for it and then she’d object if she didn’t actually want it. “Chad” would have just gone for it. It’s fucked up, I know not all women have that view but it really sucked to have it manifest so overtly.
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u/Enemyoftheearth 10h ago
Except misogynistic men get in relationships all the time because they're physically attractive. You are ignorant of reality.
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u/SoapDropper1337 8h ago
The idea that relationships are like a karmic reward for being nice and a good person is bullshit. The internet seems to think that being lonely must be your fault and anyone who complains must be some mysoginistic fat unwashed basement dweller. The worst people I know are the most romantically successful, because they have the social skills to charm and manipulate people, the awkward but well meaning guys never get a chance.
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u/Misterlee777 11h ago
Fair point because a lot of red pill content is super negative
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u/Random_passenger70 10h ago edited 10h ago
Define "rotten personality."
I have always treated people with respect. Never call women anything other "ma'am" when outside, try to help people whom i meet outside, treat women with the same surface politeness I'd treat a man with and never exhibited any differentiated behavior between the men and women that I come across in my life.
In fact, i don't think I have ever had a conflict with any woman in my life. Whether it be classmates, friends, or relatives, compared to the many conflicts I've had with men in my life.
Yet, i have been always prescribed the "just be a good person" medicine when complaining about my loneliness and how I feel like finding a relationship is hard.
Maybe we can just leave this intentionally vague, condescending advice behind, and realize that dating and relationships are neither what incels think NOR what anti-incels think.
It is something in between where it is a mix of luck, compatibility, the environment and types of people you surround yourself with, social skills, alongside things like looks and personality and other standards.
What i have constantly noticed is that people online (especially here on Reddit) will oppose a wrong opinion so hard that instead of giving the right opinion, they will pick the other equally wrong opinion out of spite.
And it is showing with how people counter incel's wrong perspective on reality by picking the opposite, yet also wrong perspective on reality.
Love was never a "morally good resource" that gets handed out to worthy candidates where the losers needs to question their "moral goodness score." It is more nuanced than that.
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u/Nearby-Reception-170 6h ago
Don’t know if a lot of women appreciate being called ma’am daily.
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u/Combatenjoyer23 11h ago
Do they get rotten personalities from red pill content or do they get that way from lived experiences with women lmao
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u/okbrat00111011 11h ago
It’s obvious red pillers hate women, why would any women want that kind of man? And instead of trying to self-reflect and become a better human being that women would like, they sink further into red pill content that’s just simping for other men’s validation.
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u/hotpajamas 10h ago
He's asking if the red pill content is the progenitor of misogyny or a lagging indicator from lived experiences
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u/Mariah_Geyl 1h ago
"It’s obvious red pillers hate women, why would any women want that kind of man?"
Are you saying shitty ppl don't have wives? Ever asked why wife beaters always have a wife to beat? I thought women could smell that shit from a mile away? What happened?
Women are just horrible at judging men, that's all.
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u/EveryLittleDetail 11h ago
This is its own hot-take generalization, but...
A woman's idea of luxury is having more.
A man's idea of luxury is doing less.
These two things can often be in conflict.
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u/Odd_Delay_603 11h ago
My idea of luxury is having someone who likes to exist in the same room as me but in a romantic way.
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u/mage_in_training 11h ago
My idea of luxury is not needing to work 60+ hours to make rent.
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u/Odd_Delay_603 10h ago
That sounds like a dream come true. I’d love to afford a one bedroom apartment without it costing my kidney and first born.
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u/MoghediensWeb 10h ago
lol. So all the male CEOs who have millions and billions and won’t quit want to do less? I know quite a few through work and they want more, more, more. They have so much and they just want to dominate and conquer.
And the women with jobs and kids who are burning the candle at both ends don’t want to do less.
I think if you’re going to make a silly generalisation you should test the counterfactual before hand just to see if you’re being a bit silly or basing a generalisation on a select cohort.
Just as I’d be dumb to base my verdict of male behaviour on successful male CEOs, you’re being a bit selective too.
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u/EveryLittleDetail 8h ago
I did say it was a hot take generalization. But to your points:
CEOs outsource their cooking, cleaning, and child-rearing. They have staff to answer their emails, plan their events, and--if we're being honest--do most of their actual work.
Women who are doing too much, sometimes it's because others are failing them and they'd love to do less. But sometimes when you clear free time for them--and I'm speaking from direct experience, here--they fill all that empty time and make themselves exhausted again.
But, again, I did say this was a generalization.
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u/cleois 11h ago
I think men, in general, have extremely high standards for women, and extremely low standards for themselves. They should hold themselves to a higher standard than women hold them.
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u/Remarkable-Star-9151 10h ago
Sorry my friend but if it was true no average woman would get like 100 matches on dating apps
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u/Year_Heavy 9h ago
Yea matches for just sex, not real relationships. Women get more matches simply because men want sex more than women, its as simple as that
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u/KittenNicken 6h ago
I'd say I'm average, I do get 100 matches. A desperate horny man will have sex with another man if it means getting their dick wet.
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u/Accurate_Web9774 9h ago
High standards? I haven't seen that. The woman could be overweight, short, average looking, no job or low level job, bad personality, has a child, and etc and will still have a line of men. I used to give these women chances but not anymore.
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u/Soigne87 10h ago
men in their 60s, 50s, 40s, 30s, and 20s all chase women 18-25. Even ignoring declining birthrates, there are a lot of men competing chasing very few women. So then attractive 18-25 year old women can have insane standards and have them met. And then women in theirs 30s and up can basically struggle finding a man even when having very low standards. The problem is not that men don't have high enough standards.
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u/MaddogFinland 2h ago
With all respect not all of us are chasing women that young. I am 51 and would absolutely not want to date a woman younger than 40 and preferably at least 45. While young women are certainly beautiful I just don’t see how (for me) there could be enough common ground for a long term relationship. And since I am done with hookup culture, don’t want more children, and don’t want to be or be seen to be a sugar daddy, the solution is to date beautiful women my own age. Bonus is that as you age you also understand beauty to comprise a wide range of things.
Anyway this is not to claim you’re totally wrong, just that there are a lot of men my age who feel as I do. Young women are wonderful, but they aren’t dating material. My own daughter is 20…I mean I am not going date one of her friends! My god the indignity of it.
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u/Skinnyfat-Throwaway 9h ago
men in their 60s, 50s, 40s, 30s, and 20s all chase women 18-25.
All? Cause I'm into cougars. How do I fit in this grand theory?
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u/Nike-Phoros 10h ago
Idk about 18-25. Younger women are more attractive for sure but I think this age range is slightly hyperbole.
I'm a 30 year old man and (if I was single) I would not seriously date younger than 25 because generally women under 25 are fucking annoying to be around for long periods of time and they look borderline like children to me.
Imo the hottest age bracket is 25-35 provided they're athletic. Unfortunately most women are not athletic and let themselves go as they age.
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u/greentea9mm 10h ago
Most people let themselves go as they age. But to your point, as someone pushing 40, I’ll take a hot 36yo that exercises over any young 20-something.
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u/Anon_bunn 10h ago
This is not remotely true in the real world. Dating is incredibly easy for all my friends, we’re all in our 30’s. The only tricky part is finding the right person to build a life with. That takes some luck is all.
None of the men I know are pursing women in this age group. Touch grass.
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u/FairWriting685 9h ago
I agree with you, most men will date in relatively close proximity to their location, income level, and within 5 years of their age.
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u/Soigne87 10h ago
i mean, if it's true for 10% of men in their 60s, 50s, 40s, 30s; that has a significant impact.
Statistics show there are significantly fewer single young women than single young men. And there are fewer single older men than single older women; how do you explain that if its not older men dating younger women?
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u/Anon_bunn 10h ago
I’m sure it is true for a small percentage. That wasn’t your initial comment though.
My response was pushing back on men pursing women aged 18-25 being the norm and women in their 30’s struggling to attract partners. Those things are simply untrue for most people. It’s an internet talking point.
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u/lightsworn55 11h ago
Far too many men just lack any sort of self respect whatsoever. Like ik mfs who have openly gotten cheated on and are still with the women who did it because theyre afraid they won't be able to find someone else
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u/CJK5Hookers 9h ago
Wasted my late teens/early 20s in relationships with women who were so obviously not attracted to me. I want to go back in time and smack the shit out of myself
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u/Bandit-Marauder 3h ago
If you are under 5'9" you'd probably do this too. The vast majority of women look at guys even remotely under average height with disgust so it's natural to stay rather than risk dying alone.
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u/Sure-thing-buckaroo 11h ago
Must be election season. Stop falling for this culture war bullshit, people.
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u/Big-Routine222 11h ago
Social media has convinced men and women that they all want unrealistic things while forgetting that only the loudest and stupidest voices are being amplified. Stop using social media as a measurement of what people want. Social media also convinced people to eat tide pods.
You ask men and women what they want and they both say, “I want someone who will be kind and supportive who also builds something with me.”
It’s not hard. It’s really not.
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u/whimsical_spider 10h ago
What if everyone just held themselves to reasonable standards and had reasonable standards for what they want in a partner?
Also, I think a lot of people would be happier and have an easier time dating if they didn’t try to change someone to fit their standards. If someone doesn’t meet your standards then just move on.
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u/JM3541 11h ago
You know how a lot of women say guys will have sex but not commit? That’s men having high standards. Men just apply them to dating/commitment and not sex. Hence why I always tell women if this is a cycle for you, you are aiming too high. I get bombed for that comment but it’s just the truth lol
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u/KindestBlackTemplar 11h ago
My second cousin was a mistress to some rich dude and she is now 36 and thinks she can only date a tall, white, rich dude. Meanwhile that dude’s wife threatened divorce and he immediately stopped paying for her apartment and everything and she moved back home at 25 and has never left lmao. She thinks since she pulled one guy like that she can do it again and get commitment this time. She is overweight too and her own parents told her to have realistic standards but she just called them misogynistic lol.
She’s had a string of situationships since, and was a mistress one more time, but nothing long term. I am glad to have delusional family like this because watching her behavior as I grew up taught me about the wider world since my parents were sugarcoating the world for me.
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u/g_lottery_enjoyer_37 10h ago
chad widows phenomenon. women smashing a gigachad, makes them think they only deserve that level from now on. would be the equivalent of a fat,basement cheetoscel, sleeping with 3 supermodels within a week. his mind will go bananas
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u/Flashy_Possible37 11h ago
Super high standards for dating, super low for cracking
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u/Misterlee777 10h ago edited 10h ago
That’s part of the problem though because a lot of these same men will complain women have sex on easy mode when it’s only easy because men make it easy
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u/Limp-Net-5167 10h ago
I’ve been telling men this for years!!!!!!!!! You call women high maintenance for having standards when in all actuality a lack of having them for yourself is a big ass red flag. A man who isn’t choosy and doesn’t have requirements and standards for his partner is going to take you through HELLLLLL. I feel like if someone has no boundaries then they won’t understand a) you having them and b) the consequences of crossing those boundaries
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u/Ok_Cantaloupe_3625 11h ago
men already have really high standards, sure they might date girls who dont meet their standard, but just to use them until a better woman comes along
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u/Odd_Delay_603 11h ago
“Just to use them” and this is why we don’t like men.
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u/Silver_Grapefruit124 11h ago
Like women don’t pull the same thing 😂
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u/Odd_Delay_603 11h ago
Did I say it was better when women do it?
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u/Silver_Grapefruit124 11h ago
Do you also not like women who do this? Sorry I guess missed the part where you made this is a “selfish human = bad” vs typical gender specific bashing
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[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Odd_Delay_603 10h ago
And you’re welcome to that opinion. Women can be just as vile as men. the end we’re all human, and humanity has proved it’s self capable of things so depraved you can’t even imagine it. Both men and women.
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u/Furrappuccino 10h ago
Uh, I think he was just saying that to point out that it's weird to say ''this is why we don't like men'' when women do the same thing
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u/g_lottery_enjoyer_37 11h ago
thats your chad goggles speaking. the men your eyes only see. average man has standards below the basements of hell.
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u/Ok_Cantaloupe_3625 11h ago
you are the third person to reply this. I dont know why you guys assume i dont date ugly men ever lol. my ex was 400 pounds and he dumped me.
"you really dont think chopped dudes dont fantasize about having a hot gf? i see tons of threads on reddit of men who want to leave their gf for getting fat or who admit to watching porn or looking at other women on the street. You might date a medium ugly girl but you always wish for someone else."
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u/g_lottery_enjoyer_37 11h ago
i mean even claudia schiffer in the 90s who was a "genetic frek", some dude got bored of smashing her. looks are not enough to keep a reltaionship. they both need to have love, humility, common values, patience etc
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u/helloworld_123q 11h ago
apex fallacy, that is just the top 10%. But i can see how you make the mistake because those men make a really large portion of relationships
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u/Ok_Cantaloupe_3625 11h ago
you really dont think chopped dudes dont fantasize about having a hot gf? i see tons of threads on reddit of men who want to leave their gf for getting fat or who admit to watching porn or looking at other women on the street. You might date a medium ugly girl but you always wish for someone else.
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u/helloworld_123q 11h ago
"getting fat" and the solution is? putting down the fork? you are pretty much guarenteed to be attractive as a woman if youre thin
for men? i advise them to not skip genetics day
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u/Ok_Cantaloupe_3625 11h ago
i am thin and still have been called ugly by my exes for various reasons.
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u/lightsworn55 11h ago
Youre describing the upper echelons of men
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u/Ok_Cantaloupe_3625 11h ago
i replied to the same comment from someone else - "
"you really dont think chopped dudes dont fantasize about having a hot gf? i see tons of threads on reddit of men who want to leave their gf for getting fat or who admit to watching porn or looking at other women on the street and fantasize about them. You might date a medium ugly girl but you always wish for someone else."
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u/headinthegamebruh 10h ago
I simply hate this rhetoric as if women don't move on to better options if given the opportunity at the same rate men do.
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u/Leon3226 11h ago edited 10h ago
I honestly think that this doesn't work both ways, and standards for both men and women would have been mostly fine if people had more opportunities to get to know each other instead of having body shop dogshit apps with cold stats like height, weight, and other shallow shit.
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u/FiveFrogs_ 10h ago
That's a recipie to be alone forever.
No one lowers their standards cause they want to
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u/Rylandrias 9h ago
Bro wants you all to stay alone so he doesn't have to deal with the competition.
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u/Enticing_Venom 10h ago
100%.
Commonly male dating advice subreddits will tell men not to express any emotion to their potential life partner because many women will weaponize it against them later or find it a turn off.
To me, spending your life with a partner who will never offer you emotional support and who will use your emotional vulnerability against you sounds like a miserable experience! The better option is for men to raise their standards. Ensure that your partner (and potentially the mother of your children) is a decent human being who is not manipulative, cold or shallow. If a woman expects emotional support but will not provide it in return, dump her for the emotional vampire that she is. If women are socialized to perceive male emotions as emasculating, then change the beauty standard. Reject women who are shallow and unrealistic. That is 100% what women would do and have done when men failed to meet our emotional needs. We campaigned for more body positivity. We demanded more support in parenting and house-keeping. We pushed back against "feminine" beauty standards that diminished women's intelligence or emotional depth.
But even these places supposedly meant to help men just encourage them to let women walk all over them. Here's how to win over the shittiest women possible: pretend you never feel anything!
Good Lord. It's so illogical that I've gotten downvoted for accurately identifying that weaponizing your deepest vulnerabilities against you is a form of emotional abuse. Excuse me, I am the one advocating for men to avoid abusers and find healthy, supportive relationships with women who will be good influences on their children. Telling men how to secure shallow, selfish, or abusive women is not "men's rights" . If women are largely failing to treat men fairly, then stop dating them. Raise the standard. It's what women are doing to you.
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u/Acceptable_Metal6381 9h ago
"Good Lord. It's so illogical that I've gotten downvoted for accurately identifying that weaponizing your deepest vulnerabilities against you is a form of emotional abuse. Excuse me, I am the one advocating for men to avoid abusers" You are right it definitely is emotional abuse, but the problem is that we don't know which women will do this to us until its too late so its safest to not give them the ammunition to shoot us in the back with. Thats where the advice comes from, I would suggest taking a bit of a risk and slowly giving them more potential ammo as they gain your trust.
Women might be better at telling which women are likely to be abusive like that just like men are often better at telling which men are likely to be abusive shit heads as partners.→ More replies (4)3
u/Independent-Library6 5h ago
I'm a lefty bisexual dude. I do push back against that stuff and I still get called an incel for doing it. People just do not give a shit.
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u/Green-Passage-7870 5h ago
This. The amount of men I see falling over themselves for someone who clearly has a personality disorder is disturbing. They seem to confuse NPD for being high value.
I meet these guys years later and they literally have gone backwards in their careers and look almost homeless. I could have told them point blank they are walking into a spiders web.
The way people are selecting people for relationships is incredibly interesting and sometimes very sad.
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u/Prudent-Result1057 10h ago
And this is how I know y’all are privileged when it comes to dating because y’all think what works for y’all will work the same way for men 💀 imagine the begger being the chooser
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u/Clock-United 10h ago
Yeah...if all you are doing is complaining about people you are getting, you aren't being a good beggar or chooser. There needs to be some individual responsibility taken to either review your expectations or improve yourself. This is such a victim mindset.
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u/blondguysdmme 11h ago
I agree but as soon as they see a pair of tits it’s game over. Doesn’t matter if she’s a horrible person, immature, unable to keep a job or a dysfunctional adult. So i think they get what they deserve lol
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u/Conscious_Pass_1615 11h ago
You think men are mindless idiots that lose all mental faculties when they see breasts?
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u/blondguysdmme 11h ago
Mindless idiots? No but they certainly value appearance much more than anything else and it’s not even close. It’s rare for me to hear men gush about their partner’s intelligence or abilities.
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u/Odd_Delay_603 11h ago
Some of them sure. Some women are the same way with men. Depends on the person.
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u/Rdr2Master1 11h ago
Most guys arent like that tho
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u/blondguysdmme 11h ago
I’ve been in engineering with 90% of guy friends for over 10 years. Most men will ignore everything else if an attractive woman gives them the time of her day
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u/IKilledJoffrey22 11h ago
This isn't gendered. Women are the same with looks AND money.
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u/ScamLordWally 11h ago
Honestly, LOWER em.
If you raise your standards while already lonely you'll just be lonelier.
Women lower the bar all the time. I see them with fat guys, ugly guys, abusive guys cheaters, etc. WE always have these specifications and hurdles. (Which is no issue, if you have a certain type/standard that's completely okay I do too), but if suses are complaining about not getting women already, this will only screw them over
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u/Final_Replacement_37 11h ago
If you are lonely, you should probably not be dating.
If you are lonely, you should make friends and then date. I think the worst thing a lonely person can do for their mental health is start dating. You're going to get very attached to people that don't care if you live or die, as most first/ second dates don't end up in a relationship.
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u/PerfectlyCalmDude 10h ago
I don't think anyone should lower their standards to be with an abusive person or a cheater. If someone says their SO ticks all the boxes but is abusive and/or cheating, I'd say they're missing a very important box or two.
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u/AdPast6057 9h ago
i’ve been saying women should be held to a genetic height standard the same as men, being short is bad genetics, don’t wish that on your future kids. select for height just like how they do, i am 6’3 and i’ll never settle for less than 5’10.
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u/OrizaRayne 8h ago
I'm genuinely curious as to why people (any people) think that being short is bad genetics. It's a weird thing to get hung up on imho.
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u/po1ar_opposite 7h ago
I think he was being a bit tongue in cheek by alluding if you are a short woman with height requirements you may be passing down your short genes and setting your future children up for being short and then therefore not being desirable.
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u/Interesting-Copy-657 5h ago
Wouldnt being short be better?
Requires less calories, especially since horses and cars are common forms of transport.
Smaller size clothing
Could build smaller houses
Overall less resources, less cost with no downsides?
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u/RakeChapman13 7h ago
Height matters but it matters more online than in real life.
Also theres this thing going on where people it feels like everyone is adding inches to their height they feel they have to. So when a guy says he’s 6’1 it’s likely he isn’t been 6 ft, a lot of women know this but then there’s women who couldn’t tell the difference.
Again height matters but it def gets exaggerated. Of course most women would prefer a guy be taller than there’s a difference between a preference and a requirement. A lot of women who even say they wouldn’t date a guy who is shorter would if it’s like an inch shorter and she finds him attractive enough. It’s unlikely that solely would be a deal breaker. My girlfriend doesn’t prefer that she’s taller but it’s whatever compared to everything else and when it comes to face and physique height matters the least unless we are talking about extremities.
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u/No-Helicopter1111 2h ago
I'm 6 foot 2, 6'3 on a good day.
women and men alike swear I'm much taller because "i'm 6 foot".. no dude, you're not.
I got broad shoulders too, so i look.. for lack of a better word.. "impressive". I'm not long and lanky.
but i do have a 6'10-7 foot (i've never asked him) that also has a 6'10 friend, and hanging out with them make me feel insecure about my height. I Should have nothing to feel insecure about!
In a room of 10 people I'm almost always the tallest, with 100 people I'm normally top 3.
If you asked the internet 6'3 is "slightly taller than average" and yet in the real world I'm paranoid about sitting down the front at the movies cause i don't wanna block peoples views, i get called lurch, and the first comment i get upon meeting people face to face after I've talked to them online is "wow, you're big / tall".. even after they get told my hight.
the internet has skewed everyones opinion on reality to the point they don't believe reality when it faces them, I'm only 6'2.5 if i wear going out shoes it's aprox 6'3.5. and yet no one guesses less than 6'6 when i ask them to guess.
So i don't blame guys for saying their 6' when they're 2 inches short. because most guys who are 5'10 saying they're 6' makes the 6' "requirement" more achievable for everyone, and they can only blame their personality when she loses interest.
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u/rosemacarontea 3h ago edited 3h ago
Height is correlated with a larger chance of drying early for a myriad of health issues not least of all being heart problems. You’re at risk at your current height.
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u/MaddogFinland 2h ago
I am 6’3” myself and I lowered my height standard for my wife at 5’9”. Totally agree though…if you’re going to produce the master race of Viking/Valkyrie invaders it isn’t happening with a woman who is 5’5” or below.
(And because this is Reddit I will add this /s to make sure people aren’t too dumb to realize I am not actually promoting eugenic views)
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u/Fun-Draw5327 10h ago
"Hey guys, we have one problem, so i came up with this solution where we can have 2 problems instead of one!, how does that sound?"
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u/PandaMime_421 11h ago
You do realize that men raising their standards would only worse the "male loneliness epidemic", right?
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u/PsychologySouth6485 11h ago
Women are not the solution to the "male loneliness epidemic". Friends are. That is what's being talked about. All of Gen Z has a loneliness problem. Even the women. It's just more pronounced among men because we had smaller social circles by default. That's being worked on. It's a big thing in my generation.
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u/PandaMime_421 10h ago
That's absolutely true. I agree 100%. But the guys who believe dating is the solution aren't going to magically find friends when they raise their dating standards.
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u/Geschak 11h ago
The male loneliness epidemic comes from lack of male social support systems due to systemic homophobia and toxic masculinity, not lack of partners. Loneliness is not the same thing as being sexually frustrated.
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u/Background-Invite238 10h ago
Goes to show how his comment proves that many men put all their emotional needs onto their girlfriends and wives.
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u/OppositeBeautiful601 11h ago
Low standards aren't helping either. If the choice is to be single and happy vs being with someone and miserable....choose single.
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u/Nicole-NB 10h ago
Wrong idea of standard. Men should raise the standards they hold themselves to.
At htat point, they would probably be less lonely, both in the friend sense and in the romantic sense.
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u/Odd_Delay_603 11h ago
Ok, and? Problem where? If you’re a decent guy, chances are you aren’t apart of the “male loneliness epidemic”
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u/IKilledJoffrey22 11h ago
There is no MLE. Loneliness is within 1% between men and women, so if its an epidemic for men, what is it for women?
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u/Lazercatt44 10h ago
Yeah they should, you know how many fat chicks there are out there thinking their shit don't stink cause they can still fuck a gym bro? I get rejected by chicks 3 times my size all the fucking time. Fellas, yes we know you can fuck a bunch of chicks that's great for you but leave the fat chicks for the fat guys.
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u/clavelnotes 10h ago
Having high standards is just dopamine hit some online guru gave you when they ‘influenced’ you. Just cuz you got graduate degree and passport don’t mean you’re entitled to raise your standards.
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u/Working_Em 10h ago
I did raise my standards after being hurt by women a few times and now it's been 8 years since I've had sex.
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u/Unlikely_Pen_8131 9h ago
Men have less standards for women they just wanna bang vs women they would marry, I’ve been with a few women that are fun but I would never introduce to my family.
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u/Select-Ad7146 11h ago
It seems like they are, the amount of young men dating is falling.
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u/helloworld_123q 11h ago
those are not because of mens preferences, but womens. You genuinely dont know how low these men can stoop
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u/Select-Ad7146 11h ago
Well, that doesn't really align with what we are seeing. You can find all these posts of women asking where all the men are. And young women are increasingly dating older men. And older men willing to date young women are not exactly known for being the best.
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u/Psychological_Bag943 8h ago
When men raise their standards they're called shallow (this doesn't have to exclusively be looks either), when women do it "That's right queen know your worth" and the worth is just them existing.
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u/PsychologySouth6485 11h ago
I be feeling this sometimes. The only standards dudes have is in the looks department. If she's stupid, crazy, broke, flat out mean, dudes will deal with it. Women care about all of that and are upping their looks requirements. And society is sex positive, so the only thing being negotiated is commitment, not sex. And that's an even playing field. Dudes ain't going to do that though.
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u/MajesticArt6533 11h ago
Why do men care what the standards of women are anyway. Clearly its working for them or they would be lowered already
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u/Wrong-Career8676 10h ago
If men raised their standards similarly to women's standards, humanity would go extinct.
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u/Grumpypaw 8h ago
Some men have raised their standards and are saving money, problems and getting less headaches by getting female robots instead.
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u/Little-Bones 11h ago edited 4h ago
Women want someone competent who genuinely likes them. If you think that's a high standard then...
Edit: Oops I triggered the incels.
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u/PraireGentleman 8h ago
So why does height come up so often? Or “looking feminine”?
We already have the data, women generally don’t know what’s attractive relatively speaking on dating apps. Men do. Women not communicating what they want and still being upset when it’s not done is stereotypically common. At least when a man doesn’t communicate, they’re not huffy about you not knowing what restaurant they wanted to eat at
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u/Expensive_Savings_42 11h ago
Haha, yeah, that's the only thing women want and don't act on anything but that. What a joke. You're part of the problem.
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u/PUNCH-WAS-SERVED 7h ago
LOL, right... Is that all?
Then why, seriously, do women have a million random things that men supposedly need to be... To the point where even fictional men can't live up to the expectations.
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u/Acrobatic-Concert430 10h ago
As a skinny fit 5'11 guy I was getting likes on bumble from pretty much only morbidly obese women, because women that looked like me were pretty much exclusively swiping out of their league. This is such horseshit it's actually insaaaane.
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u/MathAffectionate5867 11h ago
Plenty of guys who genuinely like women and are “competent” and they get overlooked. Please stop simplifying the matter; it’s tiresome.
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u/PsychologySouth6485 11h ago edited 11h ago
You're dumbing down the issue. That's what normal people, regardless of gender, say they want. Dudes say that too. I think I literally saw another guy say this in this very post. This is "nice guy" bare minimum stuff.
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u/helloworld_123q 11h ago
*an already physically attractive person whos competent and genuinely likes them
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u/okbrat00111011 11h ago
Go outside, do you find every man with a partner attractive?
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u/helloworld_123q 11h ago
having a partner≠being attracted to said partner
people on r/deadbedrooms have partners
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u/colamonkey356 11h ago
How many men are dating women who they don’t find physically attractive? I don’t see many dudes dating women that they think are like fat hogs or something.
Note: I said dating, not sleeping with. Some men will put their meat in a turkey baster.
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u/helloworld_123q 10h ago
The thing is, all women have men physically attracted to them
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u/colamonkey356 10h ago
I mean, do you really think there are zero women with no options? Pretty much every dude, even fat dudes, hate fat women. I could see a really fat woman who is really ugly having a very hard time.
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u/bulbousgrandpa 9h ago
A lot of dudes like fat women honestly. I have at least 4 friends that do off the top of my head. Maybe if someone is 500lbs+ they may have a lot of issues dating
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u/helloworld_123q 9h ago
lol we even have a slur for men who like fat women. "chubby chasers"
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u/Geschak 11h ago
Beautiful women dating ugly men is a lot more common than beautiful men dating ugly women.
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u/Kindly-Night-5549 9h ago
Women just see the majority of men as ugly and majority of women as beautiful while both arent true.
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u/Little-Bones 11h ago
Attraction is subjective
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u/Emotional-Health-717 11h ago
Yes but only partly. Let’s not pretend there aren’t men (or women for that matter) that you can show a picture of and 95/100 will say he’s attractive and others were 5/100 would say he’s attractive. I mean you know it and I know it.
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u/Odd_Delay_603 11h ago
“An already physically attractive person” attraction is subjective. Even the “ugliest” people in your opinion can find love and even marry and have kids.
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u/colamonkey356 10h ago
Yeah, exactly. My only response to the whole looksmax or idk incel blackpill WHATEVER crowd is to go to a damn Walmart. You will see the two fattest, unfortunate looking people OR the most average people EVER in a happy relationship with a kid in the cart. Relationships are really more about location and luck imo. Looks are so subjective.
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u/Desperate_Leg_40 10h ago
Thats the only requirement huh? I agree but dont be silly. Theres heaps more and its not surprising that the guys that dont qualify are disillusioned
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u/SioVern 8h ago
Same for men - they "want someone competent who genuinely likes them" (not what they make).
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u/Szcerba 9h ago
Thats an incredibly dumb statement considering everyone wants something different and you simply cannot for even a second speak for 3.5 billion woman, just like no one should be speaking for all those men.
People turning personal observations with a even a couple peoples lived experiences does not even remotely equate to what all woman or men want, millions of people, all of them are different, crazy.
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u/Late_Pepper6274 11h ago
I just want a lady with no children, ex-husbands, spare tire or tattoos.
This is proving to be a very fucking high standard.
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u/headinthegamebruh 11h ago
spare tire
This is a high standard unfortunately, 40% of Americans are obese, another 30% are overweight. Those of us who look after our bodies have a small pool to choose from. Add on all the other requirements and you're probably looking at low single digit percentage of women who fit the criteria..
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u/National_Body_9071 8h ago
Its insane how that's a high standard when it should virtually be almost baseline.
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u/Personal-Presence-10 11h ago
Hey that’s me. No piercings either. But I’m also 38, will never have kids and am already in a 3 year relationship so sorry about that lol He has 3 children (that he has full custody of) so the fact that I won’t and can’t (by choice) have kids is fantastic for him. A lot of men aren’t ok with a woman that is childfree by choice and will stay that way.
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u/Pressurevalv 10h ago
*that's conventionally attractive otherwise they get relegated to being a buddy that gets to listen to all the bullshit without any of the perks. There fixed it for you.
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u/Motor_Barracuda7359 9h ago edited 9h ago
You know you're wrong when you gotta strawman yourself and all the points made over the last decade. Gee whiz lady.
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u/Aznable-Char 8h ago
I hv a full-time white-collar job and I’m genuinely interested in dating Emma Watson. I DMed her “hey” but she hasn’t replied. Why not?
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u/Masticatork 10h ago
If you actually believe what you just typed you have a serious issue of being out of touch with reality.
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u/Nicholson65 6h ago edited 4h ago
You're joking right. That's the same thing that literally every freaking guy wants as well and heck some people aren't even able to get that in high school. I know what it's like to see a girl that you like literally melt for another dude that they don't even talk to, while I have to do everything just to get noticed in that way. And to this day I don't know what it's like to receive that type of energy from a woman. And it's not from a lack of trying I can tell you that much
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u/yunwibubu 11h ago
I think the bigger issue is people spending too much time on people who don't fit their standards, then getting bitter about it.
People really need to learn to move on to the next person if they aren't happy.