r/nihilism • u/BlackAsPopo • Apr 05 '26
Why is only optimistic nihilism a valid perspective on this sub?
Any time you point out anything negative about life and our existence, no matter how true it is, you get labeled depressed and cringe. Isn't that just a sign that majority on this sub are not really lucid and are afraid to confront reality the way it is.
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u/Suavese Apr 05 '26
I believe if the person has valid arguments for pessimistic nihilism, and brings up relevant perspectives to discuss then it’s just as valid as any other framework. People generally tend to bash “pessimistic” nihilists because most of the time it’s people hyperventilating via reddit posts, that bring no relevant arguments or perspective, don’t invite discussion and aren’t open to seeing other perspectives to begin with.
r/nihilism unfortunately suffers a lot from a bunch of people that are depressed, have noticed their indifference to the world, want to project a sense of individuality and feel validated by people; not that it’s wrong, but just irrelevant to the sub.
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u/Comprehensive_Two453 Apr 05 '26
I subscribe to albert camu s brand of Nihilisem. Or at leat I try to strife to to be like the absurd hero. Does thst make it positive? I don't know but it makes it bearable
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u/anarchoPD Apr 05 '26
Optimism is a concession to the deeply paradoxical fact of biological presence, which is yet another betrayal by No God to the nihilist, and an uncomfortable preconscious reminder of existential responsibility to them that think things matter.
What is important is that you feel a way about it, which isn't actually important unless it is, then it probably isn't not. As long as it gets you to the inevitability of evangelical anarchy, just let them fidgit.
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u/ConstableAssButt Apr 05 '26
Positive nihilism exists within a framework where it doesn't argue that is is the "only correct" viewpoint. Nihilism as a whole robs us of the ability to do that. However, without objective basis for our views, we CAN argue as to why we're compelled to think what we do while admitting objective ignorance.
Think about incentives. Positive nihilists are just more likely to be motivated to respond to peoples' existential dread and recommend that they keep powering through the dread; find reason to continue to live within themselves.
Then there's the survivorship bias. Comments recommending suicide aren't gonna survive moderation.
Positive nihilism is just more likely to survive within a community than the other branches, and to keep folks coming back. Meanwhile, folks that are a bit more "philosophically blackpilled" are just more likely to either dissociate or start using their philosophy for personal gain rather than free conversation and support.
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u/Itisthatbo1 Apr 05 '26
Personally I do hold a lot of the negative vibe as of nihilism as my ow philosophy, but recognize that the views that I hold are harmful and usually unwelcome, or easily refuted by someone else’s experience. I believe that there is no point to existence, but that existence is inherently evil by its very nature as there is no way to exist in nature in a prolonged fashion without directly or indirectly harming something else’s existence. A lot of people usually react as “what’s the point then?”, and I would say there is no point. I’ve tried to end my life multiple times and have still come to this conclusion, I am not here because I want to be here but because I have failed, and those failures have led to some biological reactions in my brain which have delayed my action in that regard.
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u/Butlerianpeasant Apr 05 '26
A lot of people seem to treat pessimism as if it’s automatically more lucid. But nihilism doesn’t say reality is inherently good or inherently bad — it says those built-in values aren’t there. So calling existence intrinsically negative is just as non-nihilistic as calling it intrinsically positive. Pain is real, yes. But turning pain into the final metaphysical truth is still a projection.
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u/FumblebudNo4140 Aug 10 '26
I've been participating here for long enough to say I haven't seen anyone say negativity was cringe. I call people out when they assert the world is horrible, all suffering or something similar. If that is your view, use the word I not we. Use me not us. People say they didn't choose to be born but can not back it up. Assuming something is fine for anyone but that assumption doesn't apply to everyone. Projection is no way to base an argument.
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u/Ankiset EX NIHILO Aug 24 '26
Because it’s a nihilist sub? And optimistic nihilism is not only a thing but like a very self evident conclusion almost half of nihilist make on their own…
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u/Cicada-Tang Apr 05 '26
I think a lot of people are trying to make the point that depression isn't a necessary result of nihilism, but coming off as invalidating depression. I don't think "you are just depressed" should be the end-all-be-all of conversations on this sub, but I also don't think people should use nihilism as a framework to reinforce/justify their depresson.
Personally, I don't like labels such as "optimistic nihilism" or "pessimistic nihilism". Nihilism is nihilism. It's a very simple and basic observation about our world. There are nihilists who are optimistic, and there are nihilists who are pessimistic. Both are valid, but neither's attitude is necessarily tied to nihilism.
That being said, I think what you are saying here is just the other side of the same coin:
majority on this sub are not really lucid and are afraid to confront reality the way it is
By implying that pessimism is the only possible/valid result of confronting reality, you are also invalidating other people's perspective and experience.
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u/BlackAsPopo Apr 05 '26
"By implying that pessimism is the only possible/valid result of confronting reality, you are also invalidating other people's perspective and experience."
I may be taking this the wrong way, but could you point out where I implied that pessimism is the only possible or valid result of confronting reality? If this is how people react to these kinds of questions, I maybe understanding the cringe reaction.
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u/Cicada-Tang Apr 05 '26
I interpreted the logic in your sentence as:
"People who label others as depressed = People who are afraid to confront reality"
or
"Optimistic nihilists = People who are afraid to confront reality"
Therefore, I assumed you were saying "If they confront reality the way it is, they wouldn't label other as depressed", or "One wouldn't be optimistic if they were lucid or confront reality the way it is".
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u/irpugboss Apr 05 '26
Because if you have any other kind of nihilism what's the point.
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u/Party_Team1104 Apr 05 '26
Yea people are inhaling copium 24/7.
Money, health all that there is. Substance. No shit we're depressed about reality
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Apr 05 '26
reality is sad but is fun tho look you missed the point everything is not painfull sad depressive and still the same i understand you're perspective but you hold the ropes in your life you came 1 time and almost 0 chance to born i dont say you need to appreciate but you came to life is not correct so you live you feel sad angry hopeless hopefull happy joyfull opportunities and dreams is not lie is real as lifes the bitter side i had many friends i had a job a best friend and still lookin forward for more if i dont get more i dont regret it or give up i still trying until im done if you need someone you can talk to me
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Apr 05 '26
The main power humans posses is focus. Negative things are true and positive things are true, it depends which one you focus on. If you focus on positive things it makes others happy, gives them dopamine. If you focus on negative things its just brings bad feelings, cortisol spikes. It dosent help anyone.
To view it from a game theory pov, you're intentionally giving out a negative interaction, what did you expect in return?
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u/BlackAsPopo Apr 05 '26
This is overly simplistic view in my opinion. Just because you focus on positive things doesn't mean that the negative things in life are not true and have no impact.
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u/ConstableAssButt Apr 05 '26 edited Apr 05 '26
If you take it as an objective maxim sure, but what if you interpret it as a subjective mean instead?
It is impossible to live a life in ignorance of suffering, but I think it's difficult to argue that there are things, broadly within our power that can enhance or lessen our suffering.
And then there are also things that are outside of our power that can do the same. I suppose what the guy you are replying to is saying, is basically just that if we use what power we have to dwell only on what is not in our power to change, we are using our power to enhance our suffering, and are capable, therefore of using that power to NOT enhance our suffering.
If you believe, however, that all free will is an illusion, or the free will that human beings have to avoid undue suffering is meaningless, then... Sure, I guess?
--My job is actually a prime example of this. I'm a developer by trade. When working in code, a highly critical attitude is extremely helpful, however, it can go too far and be a liability. A developer, to be truly effective, has to recognize the time and place for problem-oriented thinking, and solutions-oriented thinking. Sometimes we have to blow past problems and just implement, and fix it later. I know a lot of developers, as I'm a freelancer. I drop into and out of projects to fix really hard problems that peoples' teams aren't equipped to handle. And most of the time, I find at least one engineer on staff at the place who is capable of fixing the problems I get brought in to fix, but he just won't get out of his own fucking way to do it --The cool part about being a contractor is if this guy decides to get in MY way, I get to tell him to go fuck himself and then build a spreadsheet proving my approach works. If they don't like it, I keep my retainer anyway, and I've got some days to shake down new clients or play videogames or whatever. This guy is always stuck on the problems and hasn't swapped modes to the solutions. The perfect is the enemy of the good enough.
We're all made of mud and farts. Everything we make is kind of shitty. You can torture yourself with that reality, or you can use it to free yourself from getting too invested in whatever shitty garbage you've gotta make today so you can eat some random bullshit and sleep in a bed. It's all gonna fall down someday. Doesn't mean we shouldn't have bothered standing it up.
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Apr 05 '26
Do positive things not have an impact? Why not focus on that?
I am not saying negative things dont exist, ofcourse they do. All i am saying is that dwelling on them dosent do any good.
Personally i find the realization of nihilism and life being for nothing quite banal. And if it is really for nothing why should i focus on negativity? Why shouldn't i do dopamine maxxing?
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u/MisterIceGuy Apr 05 '26
What is this truth about life that is negative?
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u/BlackAsPopo Apr 05 '26
I don't know, maybe google about homelessness, cancer, wars, disease, etc. I'm sure you'll understand afterwards. There is so much suffering in life, and like the other guy pointed out in the comments, we can focus on the positive; I get that. What I don't get is the immediate dismissive attitude when someone points out these negative parts of life. It's not cringe to say that you suffer and it makes your outlook on life to be more on the pessimistic side.
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u/SPQE_ Apr 05 '26 edited Apr 05 '26
Because in a meaningless world nothing is inherently positive or negative.
Posters that pretend that things are intrinsically negative or positive are not nihilistic.
This is the point that people try to get across.