r/askanything • u/TheTokist • 8d ago
Political Question Do you believe religious organizations and churches should be required to pay taxes (ie property tax)?
Just as stated. If you believe they shouldn’t pay taxes, please explain why.
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u/poliosaurus3000 8d ago
Yes they should. They now operate like businesses, so they should be subject to the same laws as them. When this no tax thing on churches was started there weren’t mega churches with private fucking jets. Churches don’t need fucking jets.
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u/EnoughEstate7483 8d ago edited 8d ago
"Excuse me... What does God need with a Starship?"
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u/Jethro_1968 8d ago
There are about 2,000 mega churches in the USA and 250k churches that struggle to keep the lights on
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u/plinkoplonka 8d ago
Well considering most corporates don't pay any tax in the USA...
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u/Alert_Wind_6100 8d ago
Yes they do need jets, how else would the good word get spread!
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u/Bendlerp 8d ago
Ah, yes. Private jets dropping chemtrails from heaven.
Might as well steal their conspiracy theories lol
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u/AzazeI888 8d ago
It would just kill the small churches with modest congregations, and only leave mega churches.
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u/katmcflame 8d ago
No, it would weed out the corrupt mega churches & the small ones created as tax shelters to run expenses through.
God will surely protect the innocent, right?
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u/InspectorHuman3044 8d ago
You say that as if every church behaves that way. Not every church is a mega church run by a corrupt millionaire and not every church is under the Vatican.
The truth is many legitimate churches across the country are very charitable and barely covering their costs.
What needs to happen is those corrupt churches need to be audited and the problem addressed, but don’t lump legit churches in with them.
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u/poliosaurus3000 8d ago
Those churches that aren’t those churches also get to pick and choose who they help, which is in many cases a select group of people, not including people of certain races, sexual orientations or gender biased. Churches in general create cliques that exclude people and create discontent with people outside the church.
I’m sorry but this protected status of churches needs to go. Many of these churches that are “scraping by” also tell their constituents about political beliefs as well, which is illegal.
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u/Main_Community7957 7d ago
Every non-profit “picks and chooses” who they benefit. Shriners children’s hospital should be taxed because they exclude elderly patients?
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u/PaleInternet96 6d ago
Private jets and the lavish lifestyles of pastors have absolutely nothing to do with spirituality. Megachurches have turned into a truly profitable business.
I think it would be fair if churches started paying taxes, too.
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u/Appropriate-Cap3325 8d ago
Creflo Dollar says he needs your help to raise $65 million for a Gulfstream G650 private jet.
He actually did end up getting his jet. And two rolls Royce’s
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u/Pompous_Italics 8d ago
Property tax, absolutely. I'm not even anti-all religions. It's just that you're there, you're taking up space, you have access to the roads, emergency services, etc., pay the goddamn tax.
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u/You-Tubor 8d ago
The police have to direct traffic outside a moderately large church near me before and after service. They also drive more traffic congestion and wear and tear on the roads. They should pay property taxes.
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u/matajulietas 8d ago
Everyone knows that religious organizations are the easiest way to evade taxes in plain sight. The people running some of these organizations are the greediest motherf**kers i have ever seen.
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u/OldSarge02 8d ago
This applies to most charities.
Go look at how much the leaders of the big cancer charities are making.
Lots of charities spend most of their money on salaries plus advertising so they can get more money to pay their leadership more.
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u/unique_user43 8d ago
i think the current laws should be enforced. separation of church and state. no taxes on church, but they can’t mettle in politics and government. when they do, their tax exempt status should be revoked. it never is enforced though.
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u/hoostypants 8d ago
This is the easiest and most logical answer.
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u/snypre_fu_reddit 8d ago
Define "meddling" or "politics and government"? It's actually the hardest least clear answer possible.
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u/Economy_Stock137 8d ago
If political candidates are invited to speak to the congregation during a service or meeting held on church/temple/religious group grounds. (I'll just say church but mean all religious structures) If the church makes donations to a political candidate or PAC. If the church leaders, pastors/priests/etc, or speakers use worship gatherings to endorse or advocate for/against a political candidate or voting position in an upcoming election. If the church posts advertisements or signs for a candidate on church property.
If a church leader does this at their own home (not owned by the church), makes a personal donation, or advocates for or supports a candidate on their own time, it is free speech. If they do it on church property or during service/meetings, I think it is meddling and undue influence on the congregation and the church/religious organization should lose their tax exempt status.
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u/Yamatocanyon 8d ago
We already have "God" on our money, the church has already pushed way too far into politics. They will never not mettle.
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u/Illustrious_Soil_603 8d ago
Fuck yes. If churches want to be political (almost always the case), they should pay their fucking taxes. Also billionaires.
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u/1nGirum1musNocte 8d ago
Yes and they can file for charitable deductions based on their actual activities like other organizations have to
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u/Donutboy562 8d ago
Yes. Because "separation of church and state" shouldn't apply to the logistics of a religion. You are free to believe whatever you want and the government shouldn't have a say in that.
However, churches/places of worship should not be able to abuse this loophole to get out of paying taxes.
Your building is still a building, owned and maintained by a person or a company. That person or company should be legally obligated to pay taxes for owning and using this building, regardless of how it's used.
Megachurches should not exist, in any capacity.
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u/Blothorn 8d ago
Do you think the same of non-religious 501(c)(3) nonprofits?
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u/tyen0 8d ago
yeah, they should all pay property and sales taxes. If they aren't making a profit, then there is no income to tax like corporations anyway.
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u/Familiar_Ad7749 8d ago
So you now want your local soup kitchen paying taxes on its donations and property, correct?
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u/WinterElk4143 8d ago
Absolutely. Otherwise taxpayers who don’t belong to or even agree with their religion are basically subsidizing them. No free lunch just because you’re praying.
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u/Floor-is 8d ago
If bookstores have to and places where bookclubs reside have to: then yes.
Because religion is just a bookclub-cult
(Insert a bit of sarcasm and cynicism here)
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u/Creative-Air-6463 8d ago
You’re absolutely not wrong 😂 both churches I’ve attended in the past even have book stores inside and have book clubs as separate events they hold
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u/yourdoglikesmebetter 8d ago
Many churches in the US have abandoned the hereafter for the here and now.
Should their charitable works be taxed? No. Should Kenneth Copeland’s private luxury jet be taxed? Absolutely.
At the very least, those churches who have violated their 501(c)3 covenant by endorsing political figures should be taxed.
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u/VolumeHuge6095 🤔 8d ago
Yes, if they can buy a $70,000,000 luxury jet, then they can afford to pay taxes. They are just grifters grifting
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u/whoDoVooDeux 8d ago
they should be taxed exactly as every other type of non profit. if the accounting is even and public, they just pay taxes on the excess. and if a pastor has a multi million contract, that's quite public.
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u/LeoIrish 8d ago
As long as they continue to operate as a non-profit, then no, just the same as other non-profit organizations such as unions.
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u/BudgetSupervillain 7d ago
Yes, used to work in banking at 3 major banks. The VAST majority of churches are just sitting on the money people give them and paying for things like general business expenses and not doing much if any community outreach or donating. If you’re gonna operate like any other business then you need to pay taxes. There are so many churches burning your money on new cars, mortgage payments on properties that aren’t the church, and/or transferring money out to other accounts that aren’t linked to the church. Tax these scammers
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u/Visible_Syllabub4571 8d ago
Seriously? They are a non-for-profit hence why they don’t pay taxes.
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u/jtj5002 8d ago
All other non profit have to apply and be approved. Churches are automatically assumed with no oversight. Non profit also just means they have to spend it on, either salary or "property maintenance" hence why you see big fancy mega churches. Churches are also forbiddin from endorcing or supporting any political candidates, and we all see how that's working out.
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u/Abject_Performer5187 8d ago
Property tax should be completly eliminated for everyone everywhere . Whos property is it ? if you gotta pay money to keep it it isnt yours anyway is it ?
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u/Loose-Set4266 8d ago edited 8d ago
I think they should pay taxes unless they can prove the money they take in is used for the community and services and that all executive salaries not directly related to said services do not exceed more than 10-15% of total expenses. So basically the same terms a 501c3 does.
If they can’t then they need to pay taxes.
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u/Ok_Theory_1323 8d ago
Yes, absolutely, just like every other business that rakes in profits every year, even if what they're selling is the myth of an afterlife, and the form of payment is "donations."..
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u/Nearing_retirement 8d ago
Universities and colleges do not pay property taxes. Start with them, they are far more of a business than a church.
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u/ShotBoat3335 8d ago
No. There should be no contact between government and state and it violates the separation of church and state. Just imagine the US trying to find all the synagogues and taxing them, mind you the US Government is already at war essentially for Israel/AIPAC/Zionism in an effort to colonize parts of the Islamic middle east.
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u/a_filing_cabinet 8d ago
The whole reason churches are tax exempt is because historically, they provided social services. The point of taxes are so the government can provide services to the people, and churches have provided that same service, so taxing them doesn't make sense.
Likewise, if a church isn't providing those social services, then there's no reason to not tax them. Theoretically, I think the best middle ground would be some sort of deductible, where religious institutions have to pay taxes, but the rate at which they pay is inversely proportional to the rate at which they provide social services to the community.
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u/SecretOrganization60 8d ago
No. I think a tax violates the Free Exercise Clause if the 1st amendment. But churches are involved in politics are just a theatre and subject to tax.
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u/GladChef1206 7d ago
if they can donate to campaign funds, they need to be taxed. it doesnt matter in which wish granting ghost you believe, taxed.
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u/IamJoyMarie 8d ago
yes they should pay taxes and it would put a lot of them "out of business"
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u/HourAd5987 8d ago
Yes. Religious organizations in the US are businesses, some completely unethical and for profit.
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u/JohnSpikeKelly 8d ago
Exactly. Churches are for-profit businesses. They generate a lot of wealth for a very few.
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u/naughty_robbie_clive 8d ago
Yes, but only for larger organizations. With revenues above a certain theeashold.
They should be able to deduct anything spent on legitimate charitable work. If they buy a bunch of food for hungry people, we want to incentivize stuff like that.
If your pastor is a millionaire in every way but on paper, there should be taxes involved. If your organization has enough funding to have a professionally produced live stream. If your organization has a full time staff of IT people.
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u/Khrispy-minus1 8d ago
Definitely not. If you tax them, then you must allow official lobbying for input on government policy because you can't have taxation without representation. This would destroy what remains of the separation of church and state. As it stands now, they can and do make a lot of noise, but politicians are able to say "Duly noted and ignored" without a court battle over representation.
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u/HoldenMcNeil420 8d ago
Yes yes yes.
They are a business and use local infrastructure to operate period.
They should contribute, not taxing them is special treatment.
If they are very charity focused they file the whatever IRS forms for charity’s and don’t pay taxes anyway. The mega churches with pastors using private jets and driving Bentleys are a cancer and we need to cut them out.
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u/Own-Entertainer-4098 8d ago
Only if they conduct commercial activities like paid rentals, parking, or for unutilized lands.
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u/Traditional-Forum 8d ago
If they suggest you vote for any one person, YES. They should pay taxes from that day forward.
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u/SoggyPoint2242 8d ago
Have them pay taxes - they’re in politics already. Except once they pay taxes then they can be legislated and all sorts of other legal mumbo.
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u/yunwibubu 8d ago
Yes.
I believe religious institutions and nonprofits should not be taxed on base operational costs (so fees for legally required utilities and the rent/payment on the building itself) but should be charged taxes on any additional funds after those are paid. Prior to paying for any other services, advertisements, physical goods, or funds to pay people for work/labor/time.
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u/angel_rayo 8d ago
If they stay out of politics, no. But apparently they can't help themselves, so yes.
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u/Beneatheearth 8d ago
In general I agree but there are some issues people might consider political and are very much religious questions.
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u/Inevitable_Pride1925 8d ago
Absolutely, unless they primarily function as a charitable organization they should be paying taxes.
Since I doubt the tax code will ever change to accommodate this I think the ones that do overt political organization should have their special tax status stripped from them.
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u/JayPlenty24 8d ago
The reason they don't pay taxes is because they're supposed to be serving the community.
So yes, I do think they should pay taxes- but also have a lot of opportunities to claim things again their taxes. Similar to a corporation. That way they would be paying basically on profit, so the less profitable they are the less taxes they'll pay.
It would force them to actually serve the community, and not hoard money (like some religions do).
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u/that_dutch_dude 8d ago edited 8d ago
they are a business and needs to be taxed as such. including property tax. dont blame the tax man if your deity is all knowing and powerful but somehow cant do the most basic thing like balance his chequebook.
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u/Extension_Ideal_4012 8d ago
I think any contributions to the church that exceed what the building requires to operate should have to be documented as 100% use for improving the community. If you’re tax free but not actively working to improve your community then you should lose that status.
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u/ChartPuzzleheaded747 8d ago
Property tax is disgusting and needs to go away across the board
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u/AMC879 8d ago
They would have to be replaced with a different tax like city and county sales tax.
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u/HOJK4thSon 8d ago
Property Tax sure. Any other tax, no.
What you can tax, you can control. I don't want any government control on churches.
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u/RociBuldidi 8d ago edited 8d ago
Mega pastor CrefloDollar says no, he needs a 3rd private jet.
Of course, they rely on the same roads, emergency services, etc as the rest of us
The nations churches don’t pay about $82B a year in the US because of their tax free status.
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u/BlueRFR3100 8d ago
Yes. At the very least, they should be paying for the fire and police protection.
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u/No-Permit-9331 8d ago
Considering how they have inserted themselves into current politics and are as corrupt as they are, yes, they absolutely should pay taxes! They divert their money to buying private jets, which we all know, they need!
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u/BatmanOnMelange1965 8d ago
No, because then you set precedent with the government deciding what is religion and what is not. Plus, churches (in the traditional sense) do put that money back into the community with food pantries, soup kitchens, outreach, and so much more.
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u/Garfield-1979 8d ago
No, as long as they stay out of politics. If they want to talk politics, then they should pony up the taxes or stfu.
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u/WasWawa 8d ago
Absolutely, they should pay taxes.
It makes me crazy to see these mega churches (which, wouldn't be so big if they had to pay taxes).
They claim it is because they are helping the poor, and they're considered a charity, but I'm hard-pressed to believe that the mega church pastors need a private jet to feed the poor.
I believe there's actually a biblical verse about a camel, an eye of a needle, and a poor man getting into heaven./s
Also, I believe there was a bearded gentleman years ago who said something about us selling our possessions and giving the money to the poor.
This is why I don't go to church anymore. The hypocrisy is exhausting.
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u/Effective-Log3583 8d ago
Yes. I think they should have fewer tax exceptions.
I believe they should be subject to the same non profit rules as other companies and organizations. Things like charity, community works, and other things should be a tax write off. Things like ornate buildings, and the money to buy jets not so much.
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u/Soulman682 8d ago
As a Catholic, knowing my church is the richest entity in the world, tax them all! They have the money and their money pours in weekly.
Want to have a say in politics as a religious institute? Pay taxes. It’s that easy and fair.
I guarantee that once they are faced with the threat of paying, they would go back to minding their own business and quit messing with politics.
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u/LMrningStar 8d ago
Of course they should. Religious exemptions for anything and everything need to go.
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u/Pypsy143 8d ago edited 8d ago
No, because taxes invite you to the legislative table.
I DO NOT want churches at the legislative table.
EDIT: Y’all stop with the “they’re already there.” Yes, I know they are and I DO NOT WANT THEM THERE.
If we let them pay taxes then we will have no grounds to push them out, and they will entrench themselves even further.
Putting aside the fact that nobody in our current government has the spine to do it, allowing churches to pay taxes means nobody in the future will be able to do it, willing or not.
Think long term.
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u/Cheap-Success1578 8d ago
I pay taxes and I am not invited.. I think you are full of poop.
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u/TJB18-AJB22 8d ago
Your kidding yourself if you think that the are not already at table in one form or another.
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u/jimtyler2051 8d ago
Disagree with your premise because only people can vote. No organization can vote. Oh BTW, churches and similar organization seek to influence the legislature ALL THE TIME
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u/Pypsy143 8d ago
But they could start donating money to candidates, which we do not want to happen.
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u/BrightHandle29 8d ago
I’m with you here. However, it should be ALL religious institutions, not just those of the Christian denominations
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u/TomdeHaan 8d ago
A church doesn't get a vote. The individual churchgoers get a vote.
The church lobby is already very powerful. Taxing them wouldn't change anything in their favour.
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u/one_depressed_MF 8d ago
At the very least they should pay the same property taxes as everyone else, Yet they don't.
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u/2021_Username 8d ago
Who’s at the table now? Not the taxpayer. You need to be in the billionaire club to be at the table and they don’t pay their fair share.
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u/Creative-Violinist44 8d ago
I agree add half the country that are not net payers too!!!! Bring back our republic…
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u/x_xwolf 7d ago
Taxes don’t give you any power over the country if it did taxpayer dollars wouldn’t get wasted and stolen constantly.
Taxing churches are a good think to do. Its a check on their power. It stops them from receiving and extorting money from their followers tax free.
It also would make religious people pay the cost for their religion to stay upkept because now churches need to receive enough to pay their overhead and fair share.
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u/BreakfastFuzzy6602 8d ago
Dude, we are currently barreling towards a Christian nationalist country. They are already there. Tax the fuck out of them.
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u/Money_Party7233 8d ago
What world are you living in. We are barreling towards a socialist, Godless, lawless country.
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u/BreakfastFuzzy6602 8d ago
Oh man, I don’t even get into what socialism actually is but the Trump admin is implementing project 2025 as we speak.
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u/sleepytjme 8d ago
they’re already there
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u/Pypsy143 8d ago
And the fact that they don’t pay taxes is our strongest argument for why they shouldn’t be.
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u/FREE-ROSCOE-FILBURN 8d ago
If they’re going to engage in political activities, yes. If they’re going to be legitimately charitable, then I’m fine if they don’t.
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u/Lonestarpenguin 8d ago
No. They are non profits. Plus most are filling a need that government cannot fill. Catholic charities for example helps with transitional housing.
The fact that they ask for a few exemptions in cases of killing (abortion and end of life) is not a reason to terminate their status.
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u/ApatheistHeretic 8d ago
I'd they're going to put their finger on the scale of politics, they should pay double...
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u/Kilo-Quebec-Bravo 8d ago
If I buy a building on the edge of town where me and my friends can pray to Ed's dog I would have to pay. Same thing. Except we can prove Ed's dog exists.
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u/tacotimes01 8d ago
Yes, because they are basically just political organizations or pyramid schemes these days.
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u/BuBBScrub 8d ago
If I care about my karma I’d say yes.
If I didn’t care about my karm, certain religious organizations that perform the social services the government could be doing like the Catholic Church, should not be taxed.
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u/ISketchDinosaurs 8d ago
Yes, certainly.
Sure, you can make exceptions to make sure smaller organizations have enough breathing room. Religious places are (in the best of worlds anyway) a public good that offers a public service to people, including people who are not religious. It's well worth giving tax cuts to the priest who is there when someone has no where else to go and no one else to listen. We all find ourselves hitting rock bottom at some point and not all of us have family. This is how society has historically prevented some pretty dark shit from being done by the hands of the sufficiently desperate and lonely, like murder, or suicide, or murder suicides.
It's just, well, you don't need jet planes to be that priest, do you? You don't need mega churches, you don't need massive tracts of land, and you don't need millions and billions of dollars. Tax that shit lol
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u/haveblue23 8d ago
If they act like any other 501 (c) 3 charity then no. If not, yes