r/technology • • 17h ago

Artificial Intelligence Linux Kernel Developers Plan To Remove "Assisted-By" Tag Requirement For AI/LLM Usage

https://www.phoronix.com/news/Linux-Dropping-Assisted-By-Req
76 Upvotes

122 comments sorted by

69

u/ICantBelieveItsNotEC 15h ago

The original point of tagging was essentially scientific - they wanted to be able to compare AI-assisted code to non-AI-assisted code so that they could determine whether it had a meaningful impact on code quality. That experiment has now concluded, and AI-assisted code is here to stay, so there's no good reason for the tag to exist anymore.

The tag was never intended as a way for the Reddit peanut gallery to bitch about AI-assisted development or flame contributors. As Linus said, Linux is not a social warrior project.

6

u/1116574 3h ago

What's wrong with keeping it in for statistical purposes? One can imagine in 3 years time we will have a big corpus of code contributed (assisted) by different models and it will be a relevant resource for measuring quality growth, no?

33

u/MistrFish 14h ago edited 13h ago

I look forward to when Redditors who have never touched a command line will start saying that Linux is a dead OS now

8

u/Nago_Jolokio 11h ago

They've been saying that since the first one came out.

1

u/Ahayzo 5h ago

God I hope not. Hearing every year that it's totally gonna be the year of Linux, for real this time, is bad enough without flipflopping between "year of Linux" and "Linux is dead".

2

u/Upset_Albatross_9179 14h ago

Had a similar thing with a couple rounds of government funding. They required disclosing if AI was used in the creation of the proposal. They disclosed later that there was basically no statistically meaningful difference in win rates.

You could read that as AI didn't help people win. Or that AI didn't keep people from generating quality proposals.

This was a generation or two ago in models. If they did that now, basically all of the proposals would disclose they used AI.

67

u/ankercrank 15h ago

Makes sense, you don’t see “Assisted by IntelliJ” on any PRs.

42

u/Tango00090 15h ago

There are still banks that are using shit software from Temenos, they are programming in notepad++ and love the plugins that add font colours. PRs are raised through emails.
„Assisted by notepad++” would be hilarious

27

u/Pls-No-Bully 15h ago

“Sent from my iPhone” in my PR summary

14

u/Symaxian 10h ago

IntelliJ isn't generating the logic though.

2

u/TheBraveButJoke 4h ago

Ehm, you can generate a lot of code with intelij, especialy in something boiler heavy like c++

-7

u/axonxorz 10h ago

Sure, though you wouldn't write "assisted by autoconf" or similar codegen tools. At least, not in your commit message.

5

u/not-my-walrus 9h ago

I mean, if you're committing generated code it makes sense to put "this file was generated by running ..." somewhere. Maybe the commit message, maybe at the top of the generated file.

6

u/[deleted] 15h ago

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u/ankercrank 15h ago

What do you call it? IntelliJ autocompletes just about all the code devs write, and it even refactors methods that are written poorly or inefficiently…

9

u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/ankercrank 14h ago

No it isn’t, spell checkers don’t auto complete the second you finish typing a word. Modern IDEs let devs tab their way through the entire line.

3

u/kickass404 14h ago

You can do that with auto complete in messages. Comes up with three suggestions based on context.

5

u/ankercrank 14h ago

What do you think an LLM is….?

4

u/kickass404 13h ago

Not a spell checker.

You claimed spell checkers don't suggest new words, they do, on phones.

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/ankercrank 14h ago

LLMs are just large autocompletes.

3

u/Polar-ish 13h ago

It is like autocomplete if it took a prompt as an input, and output "what i meant to say" rather than anything near what you would say.

It is "like" autocomplete, in that it's predictive text generation based on a limited context window and a set of trained data.

What differentiates them is that this statement could be cut off and

3

u/Lceus 13h ago

It's so reductive to call it that. You can literally tell an LLM "how should I solve this problem" and it will do it. In an IDE you're not tabbing your way to a solution, you actually have to think of the solution and know what to write. Even project templates and more complex shortcuts/templates are nowhere near what an LLM can do. Oh the IDE helped me create a class, that's like the LLM Implementing all the business logic 

5

u/Zhuinden 14h ago

Truly written like a non-dev.

1

u/ankercrank 14h ago

I’m an eng with 25 years of experience and work at a FAANG company, nice try though. I’d wager I wrote more code “by hand” than you have.

-1

u/QuestionableEthics42 13h ago

Well that's just sad.

7

u/graypasser 14h ago

Not sure reducing usable information does any help for anyone at all, tbh.

11

u/MistrFish 14h ago

it's just noise at this point. the tag didn't specify how much of the code was AI-generated or assisted. there's no distinction between using line-level AI suggestions vs generating chunks of code. it all goes through the same code review process and is subject to the same quality standards.

2

u/oldmoldycake 14h ago edited 12h ago

Yeah who really cares as long as it goes through the same processes as human made code. This is just removing bias against AI generated PRs by maintainers.

19

u/superbird29 10h ago

My counter point is you should scrutinize code written with ai more aggressivly just like you scrutinize code written my a junior.

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u/iris700 16h ago

Why? Are people ashamed of being sad, dumb little AI drivers with no real skills?

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u/ICantBelieveItsNotEC 15h ago

Calling low-level kernel contributors "dumb little AI drivers with no real skills" is the most Reddit thing I've seen this week.

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u/iris700 14h ago

Sounds like the LLM is the one authoring the low-level kernel contributions so yeah

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u/buffer0x7CD 16h ago edited 16h ago

I guess people like Linus are also dumb according to you since he is also using it ?

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u/Throwaway246326437 16h ago

“AI BAD OR DOWNVOTES” is the general mentality in these subs.

25

u/buffer0x7CD 16h ago

Which is funny for a technology sub. I guess 99% Redditors here have never touched a production code but tend to have strong opinions on how other people should work

3

u/VaporousMote 16h ago

I touch production code. AI sucks.

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u/buffer0x7CD 16h ago

And I write production code that serves half the planet and I disagree with you. It’s a tool and whether it sucks or not depends on the user behind it. So if it sucks, you might need look into how engineering culture and tooling is around you

-2

u/Demian52 11h ago

Holy shit, check your ego dude

2

u/buffer0x7CD 3h ago

Nothing about ego. There are plenty of smarter people out there with same experience.

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u/VaporousMote 16h ago

No, it's just bad in general. I've been around in tech for a minute, it's yet another fad that in a year or 2 everyone is going to realize what we were doing before was far superior.

Just because folks in your org have irrationally adopted it doesn't mean that it is axiomatically fine.

Also, "write production code that serves half the planet" and "engineering culture" are argumentum ad auctoritatem and argumentum ad populum. You're building an argument around BS already.

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u/buffer0x7CD 15h ago

So someone like Linus is using it to make changes in Linux kernel is stupid and can’t see it ? You know the guy who is infamous for code reviews ?

Also I work on massive c++ code base that runs inference for millions of users under tight latency bounds and the quality has been good. As I said, if you try to one shot you might get subpar results but in hands of good developers it’s a big multiplier.

-> your org.

It’s not some random side project. It build software that touches the internet traffic from half of the world’s population.

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u/VaporousMote 15h ago

Again, that's an argument from authority re: Linus, and another one from "I work on BIIIIG software"

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u/buffer0x7CD 15h ago

It would be argument from authority if i didn’t have any personal experience. So you want me to believe your opinion more then my personal own and some of the most well known professionals in the field?

Come back, when you actually built any sufficiently large scale system

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u/Throwaway246326437 15h ago

Says the person who came in claiming touching production code makes them an authority

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u/[deleted] 15h ago

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u/buffer0x7CD 13h ago

Well it’s not blind when i literally use it everyday and work on some of the largest systems in the world with extremely smart people

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u/Pls-No-Bully 15h ago

Brother, what motivates you to go online and just lie for no reason? You’re clearly not a SWE, otherwise you’d acknowledge that software development has forever changed (for the better) thanks to agentic coding. Ever since Opus 4.6 (or so) it’s better than the human baseline

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u/[deleted] 15h ago

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u/Pls-No-Bully 15h ago

And I’m staff at a FAANG. If you are in anything from a startup to big tech, or if you are building an app that is on anybody’s phone, you better be using AI or you will get left behind by everyone else. Your previously solid velocity will look terrible compared to everyone else

Imagine if someone was like “I don’t use compilers, I still manually write machine code”. They’d be PIP’d very quickly and would find it impossible to find a new job

I ultimately don’t care too much about this topic because the AI debate has already been settled professionally (its usage is only going to increase more), I just genuinely think you should reconsider your position unless you’re ready to retire (which you should be financially if you’ve been a senior eng for 30 years)

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u/[deleted] 15h ago

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u/Ryguyo 14h ago

I’m just curious what you are defending here? The other commenter is correct man - this is just a rule in capitalist society. If a new tool suddenly makes a job insanely more efficient (which it clearly does if you are truly an industry professional, you’d know this) why would you ever want to pay/hire someone who refuses to use it? I think there are plenty of things to be critical or concerned about with AI development, especially around the fact that our jobs have forever changed and therefore what everyone was comfortable with and what drove everyone towards software engineering in the first place might suddenly feel very different. For some that I’ve talked with this is welcomed change, while others are quite upset with the way the job has changed. While those are important discussions, and important for folks to understand how they fit into this new world, it is simply a fact that a developer enabled with AI is going to work at a velocity that is way higher than one w/o AI. Objectively, every swe I’ve talked to regardless of their personal feelings has acknowledged that fact. So like I’m always just confused when I see sentiment like this, what are you trying to argue here?

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u/liright 14h ago

You exist... for now. Who will hire someone who works 100x slower than every other developer?

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/liright 14h ago

AI won't become cost-prohibitive, if anything it will become much cheaper. If you're actually a dev, you have to know that local AI models exist. Qwen3.8-27b can be run on a $2000 high end PC (technically even a <$1000 pc but slower) and it's on a level of the best OAI/Anthropic models from a year ago. Running that is practically free, costs just a few cents of electricity and since local models are open source, they're never going away.

Also, better AI models will fix the bugs of the previous AI models, which those already produce very few bugs, certainly less than most human code. Otherwise AI code wouldn't be so prevalent even in the linux kernel now.

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u/bgibbz084 14h ago edited 13h ago

You clearly don’t work at a good company then. We monitor AI usage closely and would fire people for not adopting AI. Our metrics have software engineers as 3-5x more productive with AI. Top performers are over 12x more productive with AI.

I’m seeing leaps and bounds in tools and capabilities and think we will be at 20x+ efficiency within 6 months.

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/bgibbz084 13h ago

Our entire development team uses AI. The ones who don’t wouldn’t be productive.

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u/bgibbz084 14h ago

You clearly don’t. Im an industry veteran senior engineer with years of experience in FAANG tech. 100% of our code is AI written these days. It writes better quality code much faster than any human.

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u/Mrhiddenlotus 4h ago

And even if it didn't on the first pass, it'll debug faster too.

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u/Omni__Owl 3h ago

A technology sub shouldn't blindly be for all technology.

That's how you get crypto bros. We can be a bit more critical than that. In fact, we should be more critical than that.

I touch production often and AI often sucks.

1

u/buffer0x7CD 3h ago

Yeah but it’s funny seeing people having strong opinion about something when they have no experience with it.

As I Said before , AI totally depends on the tooling around development and people using it. Given my personal experience working at a FAANG on very high performance systems as well other experts ( including kernel developers ) i would have to disagree.

I am sure if it sucks that bad then you will able to convince kernel developers with your technically sound arguments

1

u/Omni__Owl 3h ago

This line of argument supposes that AI can't fail, you can only fail to use AI, which I find a dangerous way of thinking about any technology.

That kind of thinking is what lost tech companies billions when pursuing crypto and the meta verse and which made a lot of scams possible. Some of the same FAANG companies you talk about. AI enables scamming too at an industrial scale not seen before.

The problem with this tech is not the amount of code it generates inherently. It's that it enables us to make bigger black boxes faster as the context windows can't possibly keep up.

This will leave us off much worse in the long term.

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u/buffer0x7CD 3h ago

Crypto was a solution searching for problem, same is not true for AI where it’s actually being adopted much faster.

Also you are talking about businesses decision that have nothing to do with the argument of technical things.

Yeah metaverse was failure but how you talk about PyTorch or RocksDB or sched_ext ( given that you’re on a thread about Linux kernel, surely you know how big it’s ) or io_uring ?

All of those technical breakthroughs are also done by same set of people. Surely , people working on some of the leading technologies will have some ideas about what tools are good for technical problems.

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u/Omni__Owl 3h ago

This is dogma.

I'm sure the people in the bay area all know what's best for tech too and besides all the blunders they made are still totally right 👍

Your dismissive, and somewhat patronising, arguments here are just dogma. You don't seem particularly interested in the idea that while AI might have some upside there are deeper implications than the surface level analysis here that have already had dire consequences and will continue to worsen our software developers.

We are already producing new developers who can only use AI out of school and they can't get jobs.

I'm sure you'll be fine though.

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u/buffer0x7CD 3h ago

Again that’s issue with individuals. We had shit developers coming out of uni even when AI is not a thing. It’s nothing new.

My team also had interns this summer and they were brilliant despite graduating in times when AI become mainstream.

Even in uni, I learned personal time learning assembly and doing low level things even if I didn’t used much of it in professional work for long time because I wanted to better my understanding on deeper level. People that are acutely interested in field and want to learn will use the tool to better understand things ( even I use it as learning resource to understand things better ).

Also, I am talking about technical thighs because the actual discussion here was technical part and with all the business issues with FAANG companies, they still have some of the most technical skilled people in industry working on novel problems. So there work is actually good benchmark for AI

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u/VaporousMote 16h ago

And yet here you are, bandwagoning on to another comment, for free upvotes. :)

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u/Throwaway246326437 15h ago

Go touch some more production code, you won’t be doing that for long with this attitude towards the greatest tool available to you.

AI won’t take your job. Someone that knows how to use it well will though.

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u/[deleted] 15h ago edited 14h ago

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u/Throwaway246326437 14h ago

Sure it is bud. Yours is so much more superior not using AI no doubt.

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/Throwaway246326437 14h ago

So you ain’t feigning superiority by not using AI?

I don’t feel attacked by the way, if you think anyone gives a single fuck about your garbage opinion on this site you need help.

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/liright 14h ago

"A car isn't the greatest tool available to you. That's your legs, and you're not making the most of them by using cars. Just walk 500 miles, it's not that long of a distance!"

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/liright 13h ago

It's a good analogy. A car is not a replacement for walking, it's a tool that allows humans to get places that would otherwise be way too time consuming and difficult. Same way AI is not a replacement for the brain, but a tool to make things faster, that would otherwise take way too long to make.

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u/VaporousMote 16h ago

You can be dumb in one regard and not dumb in others. Or do you think Donald Trump is actually very smart across the board, since he is smart at grabbing people's attention?

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u/buffer0x7CD 16h ago

Ahh I guess a random Redditor knows more about how contribution to a major like Linux should look like than the guy who built it.

Also , I do write high performance code for living , so I do have some experience when it comes to judging the correct process unlike 90% people commenting here

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u/graypasser 14h ago

Can't you say something more than using someone else's credibility and claiming weird out of brain numbers?

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u/VaporousMote 15h ago

Oh now we're coming into all of my comments like a weirdo because I said something you disapproved of elsewhere. Folks reading this, check out this dude's other comments. Each one of your comments mysteriously automatically, instantly has 4? upvotes.

I think you're full of shit, bud.

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u/buffer0x7CD 3h ago

This was literally one of the first comments.

Sure bro, Linus is dumb , so does entirety on Linux developers and some of the most well know developers.

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u/SamKhan23 12h ago

I think it’s possible sure - but that’s not what the original person is saying. They said people are “sad, dumb little AI drivers”. That’s clearly just calling them dumb. Not “dumb” in one capacity

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u/[deleted] 16h ago

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u/spliznork 16h ago

Your dream scenario, "You caught a spelling error! You have won the Internet on a technicality! TKO!"

We all deeply appreciate your contribution to this conversation.

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

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u/spliznork 12h ago

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. I award you: The Stupidest.

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u/[deleted] 8h ago

[deleted]

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u/spliznork 7h ago

Facts: I'm actually defending the guy that you're trying to make feel small, "Durrr, learn how to spell, gomer" that you shit out without addressing a single piece of any content... and hoping you find an ounce of self reflection.

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u/buffer0x7CD 16h ago

Well I am on my phone and looks like you got the message

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u/-Vano 16h ago

True, that allows deflections, but that's cheap nonetheless

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u/WarningUntested 15h ago edited 14h ago

We all (programmers) use AI to assist us. The difference between that and vibecoding is that we know when the output is garbage or inefficient, so you'd iterate or fix.

You also give the agent proper narrowed context and precise specifications. Ideally a good plan to be executed in steps so you can verify at various points too.

If you can do that, and actually keep a good technical knowledge, AI is just a very useful tool at your disposal.

Edit: to each their own. I found it useful to automate a bunch of steps on the gigantic codebase of my company, saved me a lot of headaches

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u/[deleted] 15h ago

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u/ICantBelieveItsNotEC 14h ago

I work at a FAANG company, with friends at various different startups, and I don't know a single person who has written a line of code by hand in the last six months.

I'm sure there are developers working in old-fashioned industries like banking and manufacturing who aren't using it, just like how there are developers that still have to use Notepad++ and write COBOL.

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u/iris700 14h ago

You probably live in the bay area and your friends are probably a bunch of TESCREALs. I don't care what they're doing.

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u/psioniclizard 13h ago

Exactly, some of use never found writing the code to be the bottleneck.

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u/TheThirdDuke 13h ago

I think he means real programmers that actually accomplish things. Not Reddit commenters who are playing pretend.

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

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u/TheThirdDuke 13h ago

Nice! I’m glad you learned something, it proves you’re not fundamentally incapable of it.

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u/[deleted] 14h ago edited 14h ago

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u/iris700 14h ago

I'm a programmer and I literally haven't touched a chatbot since 2023

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u/Howdareme9 12h ago

This 97 year old diner still serves their Coke the old-fashioned way.

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u/Shap6 10h ago

then how do you know what current AI is capable of?

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u/Pls-No-Bully 15h ago

Manual machine code programmers: “imagine being sad, dumb little compiler drivers with no real skills”

In reality, programmers back then happily switched to using compilers, the same way they’re happily switching to AI now. It’s just another level of software development abstraction that is greatly amplifying the output of SWEs

Basically all newly updated software you use is built using agentic coding, it’s just the reality of the industry now

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u/BoXLegend 14h ago

I'm not sure why you'd be downvoted for this take outside of cope. AI is another level of abstraction. Five years ago I wasn't thinking about trash collection-- that's an understanding that become virtually obsolete overnight with higher level languages. 70% of my job hasn't changed, but a big chunk of stuff I used to think about and study doesn't matter as much as it did.. and that's fine. That's the evolution of the job. This is like, the fourth time this has happened in engineering and isn't the last. I will never defend what AI is but anyone thinking it's going away for engineering is either intentionally ignorant or not technical.

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u/Omni__Owl 3h ago

A layer of abstraction needs to be reliable. AI is not reliable.

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u/buffer0x7CD 3h ago

That’s why we have the job ? Does AI force you to not read the code and blindly ship ?

Does AI force you to not have proper release tooling to make it easy to catch bugs ?

You still need to do engineering work. It’s a force multiplier and not meant to replace you completely

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u/Omni__Owl 3h ago

You say that but that's not how it's marketed, trained or used. It will and has replaced people at work because the belief is fewer can do more with less.

But that's irrelevant to what I said. If the argument is that AI is an abstraction layer then it's one that wastes your time. Layers of abstraction are reliable. AI is not reliable.

Therefore it makes a poor abstraction layer.

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u/buffer0x7CD 3h ago

Well that depends where you work. If you bring a slop at my workplace and won’t able to explain it during review , you’re getting chewed out at reviews.

Also there is nothing inherently wrong with fewer people being able to do more work. Thats the whole point of improving productivity.

We don’t need as many mail deliveries today with emails being a thing. So it’s not much different.

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u/Omni__Owl 3h ago

That's ignoring the societal ripple effects of what that means though.

We have seen all this before with the loom. With the loom fewer people could produce more clothes faster. That meant fewer jobs while the craftmansship disappeared, the wages lowered, the working conditions worsened and profits grew for the people owning the looms only.

AI will be no different.

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u/buffer0x7CD 3h ago

Good thing most developers have stocks in there companies or they can buy in public market to see the effect of boom.

So your solution is to keep people just for the sake of employment? Thats never been the case.

Also historically, most new technology resulted in more demands

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u/Omni__Owl 3h ago

I think you need to read up on history and how technology was mostly prosperous for the people on top not the working class.

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u/psioniclizard 13h ago

Because no one ever programmed in machine code really (they mean assembly) and the people eho worked on punch cards werent like that.

Seriously, do people even know computer history?

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u/vikinick 15h ago

No it's just assumed at this point you're using AI to assist you if you're contributing to open source.

It's just such a force accelerator in programming.

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u/[deleted] 15h ago

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u/sosthaboss 15h ago

Not really, have you looked around?

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u/frenchtoaster 13h ago

I maintain a large open source library at a large company, and I can tell you that 100% of PRs we receive are very obviously "primarily AI authored" now, I don't think we really get any "classically authored" PRs anymore. Even when it's a 1 line fix, the descriptions on the commit are LLM written.

People don't even hand type their GitHub issues anymore, a significant majority of even those are clearly AI authored 

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/ResilientBiscuit 14h ago

Yes, I work in the field. Every single professional software developer I know uses AI in their development pipeline. Some more than others but I don't know a single person that is hand coding everything at this point.

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u/[deleted] 14h ago

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u/ResilientBiscuit 14h ago

No, several different companies, some government, others private.

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

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u/TheThirdDuke 13h ago

Look at trending repos on GitHub some time.or at pull requests to open source projects

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u/ResilientBiscuit 13h ago

Industry surveys also confirm that the vast majority of developers are using AI assistance. That is neither of our personal experiences.

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u/TheThirdDuke 13h ago

Do you work in the field? Or know anything about modern programming?

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

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u/TheThirdDuke 13h ago

Mopping the floors and cleaning toilets at a company that does software development doesn’t count as being in the industry.

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u/[deleted] 13h ago

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u/TheThirdDuke 13h ago

I’m not why should I be? I don’t think I want to climb my way up though as I am about as high as I can be, as an individual contributor, before getting into management

I don’t want to come off as arrogant though - the work you, and people like you, do to keep the office clean is useful and provides real value. It’s something you should be proud.

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u/MaxRD 16h ago

No but maybe they are tired of being harassed by people like you for using what the current technology offers

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u/[deleted] 15h ago

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u/GODLOVESALL32 14h ago

This entire reply chain stems from someone calling people using industry standard tooling to contribute to an open-source project, for free, "sad, pathetic, talentless"

lol

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u/GODLOVESALL32 14h ago

Yes the people contributing to an open-source project for free are the sad and pathetic ones, not you, berating them for using a productivity tool.

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u/DiscreetDodo 14h ago

At least we have a job unlike you.

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u/Verwarming1667 12h ago

It's to protect them from stupid small brained snow flakes who make a booboo in their pants if they see any and all AI usage.

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u/CondiMesmer 13h ago

It never made any sense to include a free advertisement to nobody's benefit.

  • Sent from my iPhone 

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u/Crazytje 14h ago

I'm bad at writing up a good PR message, or even a commit message. English isn't my first language, so I use an LLM, it's what they're made for.

I would also hope any decent developer would use AI, to at least review and improve your code, if you don't you will get left behind and become irrelevant.

Just use it as a tool, not a replacement for your brain!

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u/diplofocus_ 12h ago

Can you provide an example of what "left behind" looks like to you?

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u/ProfessionalHefty349 11h ago

Being unemployable because you’re 10x less productive than your counterparts that use AI.

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u/ElonMuskIsAPissBaby 9h ago

Weird how all the pro-AI people love to quote stats like "10x productive" and yet not a single one of my coworkers doing agentic development is shipping 10x the amount of work I am.

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u/toadi 6h ago

Working in the SWE field for 30 years. I am more productive. I am not even talking about code generation here. But the access to information is amazing. Instead of googling wading through pages of crap to find some solution. Now I just ask 3 options to solve this problem with pros and cons link me the sources. I write in several languages and i need sometimes reference guides to do certain things in that language. AI just writes the code. I understand the code but now I don't need to look up how to write certain constructs in certain languages. Lots of speed gain even when not vibe coding it.

1

u/Smallpaul 8h ago

10x is an exaggeration but does it matter? 1.5x is enough and very achievable.

-3

u/DiscreetDodo 7h ago

10x is obviously an exaggeration, but there are many specific issues my team  have resolved where 10x isn't too far off. Besides, even if it were 2x, that's a massive increase no? How are you measuring output? Vibes?

We found a bug before we were about to deploy to prod, it would have taken an engineer about an hour or two to find the bug, fix it, and create the pr. With a single prompt claude did all of that in 5 minutes. 

Another issue we had was due to a bug in a library we were using but because of how the issue presented it wasn't clear what the root cause was. Claude was able to find the root cause in about 30 minutes. It was a nasty bug which probably would have taken about a week to resolve if we even could find it in the first place. 

Not having AI in your toolkit is extremely stupid. You don't have to write your code with it. It's a tool. Use it when it's suited for the job.

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u/No_Entertainer_8404 9h ago

So 10x difference doesn't hold in your case. Interesting, you're the outlier.

7

u/EzeNoob 11h ago

If AI is that great people will get up to speed in no time when they need to.

-11

u/Thwarting8139 11h ago

That doesn't make any sense. Kubernetes is great but that doesn't mean someone can get up to speed with it in no time.

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u/EzeNoob 11h ago

Kubernetes isn't being sold as general intelligence..

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u/teerre 11h ago

Writing code has never been the bottleneck

0

u/DiscreetDodo 7h ago

It sometimes is the bottleneck. Writing tests is one example. Perfect for passing off to AI, low risk, low complexity, highly structured. 

Besides, they said productivity, not typing speed.

1

u/Omni__Owl 3h ago

If the tests suck or are meaningless and no one checks, which is the scenario I often see, then those tests will just create more debt as they keep passing yet don't actually test the system properly.

In that contexts tests are crucial, not low risk.

-5

u/ormandj 9h ago edited 7h ago

It absolutely has. You spent time writing code/reading code/debugging/etc that could be better allocated to architecture/engineering work. You'd have to put together a large team with lots of juniors to take care of all the implementation while the seniors/mid-levels did the design work and scaffolding in order to avoid the pure act of writing code from chewing up countless hours.

AI has entirely replaced or heavily augmented the need for that, with the caveat that replacing that junior pipeline kills off the future mid-level and senior supply chain for employees. Unfortunately, I suspect companies are going to have to learn that the hard way.

1

u/teerre 8h ago

Engineers on average spent 13% of their time writing code. What youre saying it already reality for like 10 years

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u/ormandj 7h ago

I think you are taking 'writing code' too literally, at least in the sense I meant to convey, and using numbers from those goofy self-reported surveys and IDE stats.

Sure, a senior engineer may not be actively "writing code" as in literally entering characters into their editor all day, but they're reading it to understand existing flows, debugging issues, etc.

This is all work AI handles in an instant vs. hours, and removes a lot of the need for juniors (except as pipeline for future seniors). That's why it's all so scary, especially for those new to their careers.

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u/Mobile_Morale 10h ago

So being unemployed a few months before they fire everybody and replace them with AI. Sounds like the best time to look for a new job before the rest flood the market.

0

u/No_Entertainer_8404 9h ago

Hey look, it's a strawman.

-1

u/[deleted] 10h ago edited 7h ago

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/Smallpaul 8h ago

I think it was unclear whether you are proposing AI code review in addition to or instead of human review and that makes a big difference.

0

u/HRudy94 12h ago

Ok it seems to be about documentation and not about issues/commits/PRs written automatically by AI.
The latter would've been a very dumb thing to remove as it would just make quality-control much harder for them. But yeah, after a patch has been validated and it's clear the author knows how it works, there's no point in documenting what tools they used really.

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u/RebelStrategist 14h ago

Well, grasshopper, look at that! A comment section turning into a cesspool of nonsense. Who could’ve possibly seen that coming? Truly, a remarkable journey from a simple discussion to a full-blown soap opera while no one nobody remembering what the original post was about. :)

4

u/lovethebacon 14h ago

Bro are you tripping? What post?