r/Nietzsche • u/FlorpyJohnson • 19d ago
Original Content This sub has no substance
Almost all the posts I see on this sub are just a bunch of people arguing about things, like any other sub. It’s not a terrible thing; people and ways of thinking conflicting with each other.
Let’s just be real here, though. This sub either lost, or never had a real, vibrant Dionysian flavor to it. Nietzsche would look at this and probably think it’s devoid of life and passion.
That’s what I think. People don’t seem to have the strength behind their words to breathe poetic life into something that seems so trivial. A small piece of a social media platform which already behaves the same way as any other piece. Cold and devoid of passion.
Well, I’ll stop barking and start biting a little now! Here are some original works. Not perfect or objective claims by any means. Just passionate and words that have been lived.
“When you realize you have failed, you cannot expect to behave as if you are greater than you currently are. You can only strive to become greater.“
“We all live in a reality of great struggle and pain. Why not learn to love reality rather than hide from it? Is this cosmic game of hide and seek not exhausting?”
“Success breeds success and failure breeds failure, but nobody likes to fail all the time. Nobody likes to hate life, or feel no purpose in living it, or have their purpose dictated by other people or a God. Reality either destroys them, or forces them to grow.
Evolution at its finest. We have not transcended evolution with our intelligence, or thrown a wrench into its gears. Our intelligence is the catalyst that allows us to evolve in a way that no other animal does.”
“I am an iron fortress. My gates are almost always open. However, my guards are always prepared for invaders, saboteurs, thieves, and charlatans. My army is battle-hardened and eager for conquest. One cannot expect to besiege such a fortress without heavy losses. The rational choice is not to attack.”
“People love abstract ideas so they can simplify reality into something easily digestible and comfortable.
We evolved from apes and still share about 98% of our DNA with chimps. The biggest difference between us and chimps is our intelligence. One can infer from this that there are causes for our actions, which entirely contradicts free will.
Not to mention, if our actions can be uncaused, then why does it matter if they were harmful or not? We can’t even do anything then. We have nothing to change or work with.
People then divide each other and themselves into ‘good’ or ‘evil.’
‘Lazy’ or ‘hardworking’.
‘Smart’ or ‘dumb’.
‘Funny’ or ‘lame’.
‘Weird’ or ‘normal’.
They’re all usually useless labels that don’t help to change anything, and they dumb people and their actions down. It directs the focus away from the real consequences of people’s choices, and the reasons they made those choices in the first place. It places the blame entirely on the person themselves. Another abstract idea like their ‘conscience’ or their ‘soul’.”
Hope you enjoyed! They’re not in any significant order. They’re kind of a jumbled mess, just like life!
Edit: Thank you to everyone who has commented, or will comment in the future. I made this post to invite people to attack my beliefs, as well as to throw a few punches out myself. I love that I can do this on a whim.
Edit 2: “It is true we love life; not because we are used to living, but because we are used to loving. There is always some madness in love. But there is also always some reason in madness." -TSZ, “On Reading and Writing”
“He who writes in blood and aphorisms does not want to be read, he wants to be learned by heart.” -TSZ, “On Reading and Writing”
“Another thing is war. I am naturally warlike. Attacking is one of my instincts. Being able to be an enemy, being an enemy — these require a strong nature, perhaps; in any case every strong nature presupposes them. It needs resistances, so it seeks resistance: aggressive pathos is just as integrally necessary to strength as the feeling of revenge and reaction is to weakness.” -Ecce Homo, “Why Am I so Wise?”
10
u/Careless-Charge9884 19d ago
Sir, you dropped your monocle!
6
-2
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
You’re literally proving my point that there is no substance here lmao. Do you have any genuinely constructive criticism? Any poetic words that make it almost natural to agree, or understand at least because they’re grounded in reality and strength?
14
u/Careless-Charge9884 19d ago
Here is some poetry then: I don't believe you came for a conversation. You came for your echo, your own voice ringing back from the corridor you built to hold it. You wear depth like a borrowed monocle, Whilst wading the shallows and calling it the ocean.
2
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
Eh, I think it’s ok. You’re relying too heavily on the punchiness of certain words to get a shallow message across. I’m not even saying you’re wrong here. Part of me is definitely posting this for my own, selfish benefit. But would I be typing what I just said if I was not striving to better understand your point right now?
I’m not just trying to listen to myself talk. I’m trying to create a measurable change in this sub, mainly by attacking things that I see people saying in it and by breathing my own artistic meaning into it. I’m trying to create a measurable change in the people on this sub. I don’t know how big or small that change could be. All I can do is post my ideas and let reality test them.
4
u/Careless-Charge9884 19d ago
If great insights were common online, or else where, then it would then be oxymoronic. You are trying to change something I believe to be unchangeable, especially in large groups such as this. I also believe you know this, and therefore you are performing a quasi virtue signal about how "enlightened" you are.
0
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
You’re trying to psychoanalyze me; get out of my head! 😭
What exactly is unchangeable here? Does this mean you’re admitting that you’re a participant in an echo chamber? That you’re a part of a “herd”, and that we cannot change this? You’re putting the responsibility for people’s actions on the world or things beyond us. You’re actively giving away your power to things beyond you, when you DO have power to change things!
The words you’re reading right now are something that can influence you to change. Whether they’re all “right” or “wrong”, or objectively true or not is irrelevant if they can produce change and growth within others. That’s it. If you think I’m virtue signaling, give me clear reasons how and why. Don’t just make such a claim with no basis and expect me to believe you.
3
u/SpiderCollective 19d ago edited 19d ago
You are naturally getting a bit reactive and defensive about your post and comments, which is frankly understandable and something almost everyone does. Usually when I have put in the effort to make a post I think it is good enough to be shared and I would be upset if people started telling me it was bad.
The Nietzschean perspective would be something along the lines of put in enough skill that your post is good enough to post and then once you've done that, take feedback that is reasonable from people with more knowledge than you and adjust your beliefs if it makes sense to do so. With feedback from people less knowledgeable than you, you should have the ability to see where the error is and not let it bother you, and either engage in a reasonable discussion or move on as you choose, because you have the power to decide how to respond. You should also be able to see where someone is not engaging in good faith and be able to constructively back away.
Again, this is all extremely hard to do and that is why nobody is the Übermensch but rather the bridge to the Übermensch (or that's one of the reasons).
Power doesn't involve telling other people to change. Telling people to change is weakness.
-1
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
Everything you just said, I agree with. I never told people to change. I don’t try to attack people themselves. I try to attack their actions and the consequences of those actions. It’s a fair criticism if I genuinely made someone feel attacked, but that’s not what people are saying. People are saying that I’m wrong, or they’re insulting my character!
2
u/SpiderCollective 19d ago
you said above, "I’m trying to create a measurable change in the people on this sub." so that is why I thought you were trying to get people to change.
It’s a fair criticism if I genuinely made someone feel attacked
People are saying that I’m wrong, or they’re insulting my character!
So these two lines are genuinely where the problem lies. I will ignore the character insults for now and focus on what you consider a fair criticism. People who engage in intellectual discussions or creative environments generally don't care about being told they are wrong so long as it is done in good faith. It is not an attack to tell someone they are wrong. Take for example this post on r/writing. Of course, there is a lot of nuance as to when it is appropriate to give feedback to someone or engage in discussion with them, but when done right it is a good thing to be able to have your work critiqued. To tie it all back, Kaufmann's discussions of Nietzsche have talked about how much Nietzsche would probably have enjoyed someone who was on his level enough to debate his work.
You seem to think that saying someone is wrong is an attack, but that is not how most people here are viewing it.
As far as the insults to the character, some of that is probably not in good faith, but some of it is also because you aren't engaging in standard intellectual discussion, and so people are left with very few ways to engage with you as a result. It is my belief that rhetorically, Nietzsche often uses harsh and insulting language in part because it is less condescending to insult someone than other ways to tell someone they are wrong, so you may be seeing some of that as well.
1
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
I didn’t mean to say that it’s automatically an attack when someone tells you you’re wrong. That would contradict 99% of the shit I’ve been saying thus far. I meant to say that people are telling me I’m wrong without any basis or real understanding of what I’m actually saying.
How does it seem less condescending to use insulting language towards people themselves? I think it’s a lot more productive to attack the actions. The actions are something we can tear apart, analyze, and change. The people themselves can either be mostly fluid or mostly stagnant. We can’t expect to directly change how stagnant or fluid someone is with words.
→ More replies (0)2
u/Careless-Charge9884 19d ago
Yes, I probably am part of a herd of sorts, and a participant in an echo chamber. I wouldn't say I am giving away power or resigning it in this situation. I am making an observation about large groups online and people in general.
0
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
You’re using that observation to claim that you cannot change the world or yourself. At least that’s what I think you’re doing. If that’s not it, you can either explain yourself better or just let the argument end. I don’t see much point in continuing otherwise.
2
u/Careless-Charge9884 19d ago
No, I am saying we can't change reddit or discourse in the way you what is unless you made your subreddit lol😂😂😂
0
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
Uh, this didn’t really explain things better. You still haven’t explained why we can’t change things.
→ More replies (0)2
u/Defiant-Bend1147 19d ago
You're labouring under delusions of grandeur, is what you're doing.
0
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
You neglect to tell me how. It leaves me with nothing to work with.
2
u/Defiant-Bend1147 19d ago
Oh no, what a shame.
1
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
Your words show a lack of empathy and understanding.
1
u/Defiant-Bend1147 19d ago
And yours are nothing but a stream of self-aggrandising, pseudo-intellectual pabulum.
1
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
I think this is a projection. Look at what you’re saying. There’s no intellectual depth to it at all! It’s hypocritical.
→ More replies (0)
4
u/SpiderCollective 19d ago edited 19d ago
Thanks for sharing your work. I think your material has character but needs a lot of refinement, and here is some selected feedback I have:
- Why did you jumble them when it is generally understood that Nietzsche's aphorisms should be read as connected?
- Iron fortress: does this not contradict many of Nietzsche's ideas? There are many things wrong with it I think, but some concrete counter examples are Zarathustra's On the flies of the market place and BGE what is noble?.
- "They’re all entirely useless labels that don’t help to change anything." This paragraph is very wrong I think. Nietzsche talks a lot about the various values one can have and the importance of having them. For example, Zarathustra's prologue §4.
- "Success breeds success and failure breeds failure, but nobody likes to fail all the time. Nobody likes to hate life, or feel no purpose in living it." On the contrary, I think Nietzsche talks a lot about how much people like to hate life in his discussions of asceticism.
-4
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
They’re jumbled because I didn’t write them all at once. They’re taken from pieces of arguments and notes and thoughts over the course of a couple months, and I refined them myself. You can read what I wrote as connected here as well.
Why do I need to follow all of Nietzsche’s ideas? Why should that be my goal, or anyone’s goal? The goal should be to become genuinely stronger people and love life as it is, while striving to create our own purpose in living it. I don’t think you understand what it really means either. It’s a philosophy of deterrence through strength and community. I allow people and ideas into my life, but my strength and the strength of others allows me to decide for myself what is worth keeping around.
I actually changed my mind about this yesterday, I just forgot to change that one word, “entirely” to “usually”. Whoops. Either way, can you explain how it’s wrong with the meaning I intended to convey now hopefully understood?
You neglect the bigger point I made about how reality either destroys people or forces them to grow stronger and adapt to it. And again, my goal is not to follow Nietzsche’s beliefs like he’s my dad.
6
u/SpiderCollective 19d ago
ah now I understand why people don't usually engage with your kind of post.
-3
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
Do you have any constructive criticism or are you just gonna fire a bullet into the dark without trying to hit anything?
7
u/SpiderCollective 19d ago
I gave you my constructive criticism already. Your work is not good enough to break free of Nietzsche's ideas, so my recommendation is to not justify what you did by saying "he's not my dad." You have to learn to color within the lines before you can break free of that.
1
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
You gave constructive criticism at first that would have been great if I was trying to say what you thought I meant. Now you’ve conveniently run out of constructive criticism and can only say my work is “not good enough”. I’ve read tons of Nietzsche. I honestly think I’m coloring more within his lines than you are.
4
5
u/WormSlayers Dionysian 19d ago
ngl I didn't even read your post, but I love this sub because it's the perfect combo of shit posting, rage baiting, genuinely ignorant takes, people who just love and want to discuss Nietzsche, and the rare person who actually seems to have deep insight and understanding into his work, the combo is jarring, absurd, and very entertaining
it is rare to find a post without one actually thought provoking comment, and that is actually rare for Reddit
amor fati go brrr
-1
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago edited 19d ago
I like your insight. We just seem to have two different ways of enjoying the sub. I don’t resent anyone here for blindly attacking me without much real basis, or for the fact that the sub usually has no real substance. I love it, because I can create my own meaning out of writing in it, strengthening the validity of my own beliefs, and possibly inspiring change in others.
3
u/formuolin 19d ago
Your meta post complaining about people complaining only adds to the circlejerk
1
2
u/CerebralMushroom 19d ago
Nietzche wouldnt want us to give two shits about what nietzche thinks about this sub.
5
3
1
1
u/Neat-Nefariousness75 18d ago
Do you wanna join my secret order?
1
u/FlorpyJohnson 18d ago
Sounds exciting, where do I sign up?
1
u/Neat-Nefariousness75 16d ago
We talk about how we perceive humanity within us and how we can live a more authentic human experience in this distilled world. The sun gives us some of the answers.
1
u/FlorpyJohnson 16d ago
What did the sun tell you? When I look at it, it doesn’t speak to me, things just start to get really dark!
0
u/CDHoward 19d ago
This is reddit, so unfettered words oozing with passion, honesty and controversy are not allowed.
1
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago
I appreciate you saying this lol. I knew most people would immediately dismiss my post because it makes them uncomfortable to expose their flaws. We all have flaws. I love when people expose mine in grounded and empathetic ways. People often think of empathy like it must feel kind, and it must feel good. Sometimes the most empathetic thing you can do is tell someone that they fucked up, and how they fucked up.
-1
u/I-mmoral_I-mmortal Swohlgeraten 19d ago
Worthy of an upvote, even though normally I just shit all over these posts because they're often of little substance also. This is actually decent, pointing out how people pigeon hole concepts into Black and White categories and try asserting Nietzsche is the same via reification. Nietzsche's a master of the nuance of dancing between two antagonistic tyrannies.
They're still trick fucked by grammar psychology.
-1
u/FlorpyJohnson 19d ago edited 19d ago
The fact that you and others see my post this way serves as proof that anyone firing off a shot at me without knowing what they’re actually aiming at are probably wasting their ammo pulling the trigger in the first place. Thank you.
8
u/Defiant-Bend1147 19d ago
Facile self-help rubbish, no better than the banal stuff posted to r/Quotes_Hub