r/Dentistry • u/Dr__Reddit • 1d ago
Dental Professional Southern California a dream?
I’ve seen several negative posts about the job market there, but wondering about my specific situation. I don’t need or want to live in a major metro area. I want more family friendly area so is the job market just as bad in these areas and what can you expect working part time? I have a substantial amount saved so I don’t need a lot to live off of, just to help with daily living expenses ect.
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u/DillerDMD 1d ago
Look up Rancho Bernardo or Yucaipa - very family friendly
Dentistry is still a bloodbath there compared to other parts of California, just not as bad as within 5 mi of the coast
The question is are you wanting to live in SoCal so bad you’re willing to work anyway or buy a very high priced dental office? If the answer is yes then there is opportunity but it’s a slog
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u/Dr__Reddit 1d ago
I own right now and make a ton working only 3 days. I have enough money for retirement and to buy a house outright there right now. So my thinking was I wouldn’t need to make too much?
I don’t quite understand why dentist do make as much there where their is so much wealth in the area? You’re doing the same procedures for the same prices right, what’s the difference?
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u/Illustrious-Bath-793 1d ago
If you are in the areas that “feel like” SoCal, I’m talking most of LA/OC/SD counties, then it will be very competitive. Because that’s where every dentist in America wants to live. However if you are OK going to places like deep San Bernardino county etc, then it’s much easier. But it feels more like Arizona or someplace.
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u/Dr__Reddit 17h ago
Yes I’m going for the socal feel definitely, don’t want to deal with the heat. My question is if I’m coming with several million dollars, my thinking is I can just work part time to supplement my life, I don’t have enough to fully retire just yet, I’m in my mid 30s
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u/Illustrious-Bath-793 17h ago
Guess question is - are you planning on being a part time owner of an office? If so that will be tough, becuase apart from competition, we have a severe staffing shortage. So good luck finding people who only want to work 3 days or whatever you are planning. But coming in with mid 7 figures obviously gives you a huge advantage over most startups.
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u/Dr__Reddit 17h ago
I don’t think I want to open a practice again. What is realistic associate pay based on production not a minimum, $1000? At least
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u/Illustrious-Bath-793 17h ago
Sorry I thought you were talking startup. If you have a couple years of experience, aren’t slow and can do bread and butter dentistry $1k should be easy in a PPO office in a nice part of town.
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u/SoundFun5709 1d ago
Inland empire/perris/san bernadino or go up to the AV. But likely seeing lots of medicaid in those areas and you just be grinding doing $400 crowns in to perpetuity 🤮🤮
Any well off areas that can afford higher fees r super saturated/ppl dont need as much work, and even then the fees in socal are abysmal. Dentical is even lower so you just have to make up in volume which is fcking awful longterm.
Probably the ffs people on the west side/newport/san diego r doing well but it’ll be hard to break into those spaces and require all-in on dentistry rather than taking the backseat
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u/moremosby 1d ago
The farther you get from the 5 you really have to ask yourself why bother living in SoCal and paying high taxes. There are some great offices out in Palm Springs, but it’s Palm Springs and it’s unlivable during the peak of summer.
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u/Dr__Reddit 1d ago
Exactly. I live in Fl now. I want to go for the better weather, not another Florida heat
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u/Dr__Reddit 1d ago
Thanks for the response. So you’re saying it’s so competitive that even FFS has lowered their fees to rock bottom prices, could you give some examples? I definitely wouldn’t take any government insurance. People have so much money there, I’m struggling to understand the disconnect.
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u/SoundFun5709 1d ago
The thing is, people do NOT have so much money here, the average household income in SoCal is actually lower than expected. As someone else said, many many people are house poor, going month to month trying to keep up appearances. Rlly quite sad actually. The truly well off people are concentrated in certain pockets, gated behind old money or certain ethnicity groups. The likelihood of you breaking into those spaces is slim.
I did middle/high school/college in socal and my parents are there. Im doing endo now and even with that, aint no way im going back to socal, so much so i broke up with a serious gf over this
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u/Dr__Reddit 1d ago
Wow that is wild. Definitely not what I thought when I think about that area. You don’t think the cost is worth the insanely weather and activities available?
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u/SoundFun5709 1d ago
To me, no. There are better pockets elsewhere and with more income you could just vacation more imo
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u/moremosby 1d ago
FFS can have high fees, but you can make your fees as high as you want, seeing one patient a day isn’t going to cut it.
Most people do not have a lot of discretionary income in SoCal. The bulk of the patient pool is house poor to the max. If you live in Irvine and have a family income of 275k you live month to month. After taxes, mortgage, gas, insurance (home and auto) and utilities most of the people out here are tapped out and unwilling to give up their “social” life over dentistry.
While house poor, the population is great and very affluent and has very little tooth decay, most teens go through ortho as it’s culturally expected to have straight teeth in most parts of SoCal.
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u/Dr__Reddit 1d ago
Very interesting. I live in a high income area in FL, and have seen similar things here. It’s expensive for everyone everywhere and yes many middle aged pts we have also don’t need a lot. It’s difficult to get enough patients in the door because it’s that over saturated more so than people just can’t afford anything?
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u/moremosby 1d ago
While there are many places where cost of living is high, SoCal is usually the worst due to decreased wages (sunshine tax), high taxes, high insurance (just auto insurance can be 4-6k a year if you commute like many of us do), high housing costs, and everything else eating away at your income.
San Diego is usually the most expensive place to live even though housing is more expensive in the Bay.
Insurance reimbursement in SoCal is lower than NorCal by a lot in my experience.
It’s hard to get patients because we’re all competing for a smaller and smaller segment of the population - middle class, white or blue collar workers. That segment is getting smaller and smaller as a % of our population while the working poor segment grows. The truly wealthy are increasingly living here 5 months out of the year.
When I grew up here, families were everywhere. There are almost no kids here anymore. Every county is getting older and the older patients without earned income are being squeezed too much to afford treatment.
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u/moremosby 1d ago
It’s really hard out here. But if you have a go getting attitude and are willing to work like nobody else, you can make it work - that means you run 3 columns 5 days a week and that’s fun for you - you can make a living as an associate.
If not, you need to own a practice. In many areas you’ll no longer be able to afford to buy a house with average GP earnings.
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u/Dr__Reddit 1d ago
I absolutely don’t have that. I don’t love dentistry and try to work as little as possible. I own now and not sure if I want to start all over. Sounds like I should milk what I have right now for a few years possibly. My idea would be to go to cal semi retired, so I don’t need to earn a lot. I would have house paid off and enough for retirement ect.
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u/moremosby 1d ago
“Trying to work as little as possible” does not work out here. You absolutely must come prepared to do whatever it takes to win. There’s no room for people to dabble and make it here, you have to go all in and be committed to being in the top 5% of the profession knowing full well that most of us will never get there in this market.
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u/nitelite- 1d ago
Southern Cal
DFW, TX
Miami, FL
Too saturated and a race to the bottom