r/BeAmazed • u/willis7747 • 14d ago
Miscellaneous / Others Hungary to impose wealth tax on the richest people starting next year
495
u/Uncle__Touchy1987 14d ago
Hungary is planning to introduce a 1% annual wealth tax on net assets exceeding 1 billion forints (approximately $3.1 million USD) starting January 1, 2027. [1]
Key Details of the Proposed Tax
Rate: 1% per year. [1]
Threshold: Applies only to the portion of net wealth above 1 billion forints.[1]
Tax Base: Broadly covers real estate, bank deposits, cash, securities, investment accounts, company stakes, and high-value luxury items like yachts, private jets, and art. [1, 2, 3]
Timeline: The finalized bill goes to parliament in October 2026 alongside the state budget, with implementation targeted for 2027. [1, 2]
Background and Context
Political Shift: Driven by Prime Minister Péter Magyar and the Tisza party, the tax aims to reduce wealth inequality and address fortunes accumulated during the previous administration. [1, 2, 3]
Revenue Goals: The government estimates the levy could bring in between 300 billion and 600 billion forints annually. [1, 2]
Challenges: Legal and economic experts note potential hurdles, particularly regarding the complex valuation of private company stakes—an issue that caused a previous wealth tax attempt to be struck down by Hungary's Constitutional Court in 2009. [1]
211
u/Kindly_Fox_5314 14d ago
Loose math shows this money will account for 0.6-1% of their annual spend which is 49,000 billion forints.
41
10
u/Amygdala57 10d ago
Yeah when they introduced that in Spain I loosely recall they ended up collecting a tiny fraction of what they had anticipated. Somehow wealth tends to disappear when you try to actually count and tax it 🤔
6
u/Fearless_Entry_2626 11d ago
Main point of a wealth tax is to nerf the wealth hoarders, so they don't have as much power to run amuck on your society, something Hungary has had a lot of issues with.
→ More replies (1)2
u/lilium_1986 13d ago
It's a start , as long as they can't scape the tax with properties or other nonsense
201
u/Dev_878 14d ago
Oh my god they actually did the 1% Tax thing. That's, like, the thing whenever in some dystopian fiction some super rich guy is complaining about a politician and the followup is usually that politician dying.
Actually, isn't that the plot of the Mall Level in "Cruelty Squad", you killing a Politician that proposes a 1% Wealth Tax?
→ More replies (1)58
u/Theron3206 14d ago edited 13d ago
They might do the thing.
It hasn't passed parliament yet. Even if it does, their courts struck the last attempt down.
This could still be political grandstanding at this point.
10
u/HK-65 13d ago
Magyar's party, Tisza, can literally rewrite the constitution, they actually plan to as well. This wealth tax and a new constitution were among their campaign promises, this is what they got their mandate for.
Right now, they have total control of the parliament, and no court can override them if they change the constitution.
The only way this fails is serious party infighting, which hasn't happened yet with Tisza.
→ More replies (1)21
27
u/BemusedTriangle 13d ago
This works best if every country does it… there’a nowhere to hide then!
→ More replies (5)7
u/moseley101 13d ago
This is key. All countries need to coordinate when it comes to corporate/super rich taxation.
→ More replies (40)→ More replies (64)7
u/A_Monsanto 14d ago
I wish them all the best!!!
I hope they remain in power for decades to come!!!
→ More replies (1)
2.1k
u/ctgrell 14d ago edited 14d ago
Glad my country is presented in this sub. Highly recommend watching some videos about all the things that are happening. It's like fresh air
720
u/Data_Over_Dogma 14d ago
Congrats to Hungary. Keep taking steps to insulate your democracy.
Americans don’t realize Trump is following Orban’s playbook.
Let’s hope it doesn’t take us a decade to dig ourselves out of this hole.
283
u/ctgrell 14d ago
Honestly on the election night after crying from happiness for several hours, I thought about how significant this win was to the whole world. We did know Trump was copying Orbán's homework. And also that Orbán was Putin's lapdog. Now that he is gone maybe the world can heal a little
92
u/Andysm16 14d ago
Thisss!!! Healing is what we ALL need right now. I'm happy for you all in Hungary, and hope that the rest of the world can one day heal too ...because this is so fucking EXHAUSTINGGGGGG
14
u/Bob_the_Drug 14d ago
Serbia is next on the 25th of October, stay tuned! 😎 Students are winning!
4
→ More replies (2)3
23
u/pseudo_babbler 14d ago
Omg didn't even realise Orban was gone, congrats!
15
u/JoeyDJ7 14d ago
I want to climb down below the rock you've been under
19
u/pseudo_babbler 14d ago
Lol I am down under, in Australia. Surprised our local papers didn't report on it though, I read them most days.
→ More replies (4)15
u/Leeroy1042 14d ago
Wild, it was all over news in Europe, which I geuss makes sense.
Really big win for democracy and the people og Hungary.
9
u/KevinFlantier 14d ago
And the people of Europe in general as Orban was a veto machine working for Putin, and friends with most if not all the far-right wannabe dicktators in every european country.
→ More replies (2)32
u/KnowledgeIsDangerous 14d ago edited 13d ago
He isn't gone. He lost a major election, but he isn't gone.
That line of thinking is why the US lost to Trump the second time
Edit: sounds like he can't legally return. I'm glad for Hungary and the world. The threat he represents still won't die and we need to fight it every day.
26
u/Data_Over_Dogma 14d ago
“The Hungarian Parliament approved this change as an amendment to the Fundamental Law in June 2026.
Impact on Viktor Orbán: The retroactive nature of the rule prevents former long-serving Prime Minister Viktor Orbán from returning to the office after previously serving for a combined 20 years.”
I accept the point to always stay vigilant
→ More replies (1)31
u/ctgrell 14d ago
Trust me. He is over. He tried recently to have rallies. They had to pay to people ti show up and even then there was maybe a hundred there. The caneras tried their best to make it look like a big nuumber 😂 Also may I add most of his party who was in the parliament are going away one by one. They cannot win any arguments. Not just because the new party has supermajority. It's just stupidity can't win against logic and they are giving up. Fun to wake up to news about one more person leaving their mandate
→ More replies (1)25
u/Unique_Situation_508 14d ago
Don't ever get too complicit and think those kind of people ever "GO AWAY". They hide, they lurk, they recruit. All in the shadows...and then, like the neo-natzi's of today, they'll keep trying to rebound until enough people are once again full of fear and hate and mistrust.
History is cyclical. Everything comes back 'round. All we can do as decent human beings is try to keep it at bay for as long as possible.
11
u/ctgrell 14d ago
Thank fuck they are old and so are their followers (whoever left). I don't think the same people will win again. One thing for sure: Orbán at least cannot be the prime minister ever again. They made a new rule about it to follow the American rules, only 8 years is allowed
→ More replies (1)7
u/headrush46n2 14d ago
Where will he go next? This phantom from another time, this resurrected ghost of a previous nightmare. Chicago? Los Angeles? Miami, Florida? Vincennes, Indiana? Syracuse, New York? Anyplace, everyplace, where there’s hate, where there’s prejudice, where there’s bigotry. He’s alive. He’s alive so long as these evils exist. Remember that when he comes to your town. Remember it when you hear his voice speaking out through others. Remember it when you hear a name called, a minority attacked, any blind, unreasoning assault on a people or any human being. He’s alive because, through these things, we keep him alive
→ More replies (3)17
u/BabyLegsOShanahan 14d ago
It's going to take more than a decade, maybe 3-5.
5
u/Fluffatron_UK 14d ago
It's a generational problem. Most people around the world of voting age want absolutely nothing to do with USA anymore. It's going to take a lot to shift that back to positive after how much this administration has been shitting on everyone, and there's enough people in the country who support it that I don't think many people around the world will be very forgiving.
27
5
u/747WakeTurbulance 13d ago
Trump isn't smart enough to follow anyone's playbook.
There is no master plan, just dumb decisions.
→ More replies (2)2
u/Data_Over_Dogma 13d ago
Trump is an ideology not just a person. Of course Donny Dimentia isn’t the mastermind, he’s just the cult personality.
Did you read that and think anyone thinks it’s just Trump, himself?
Project 2025 is literally the master plan
Keeping in line with this topic search for Bannon’s comments on Orban. See Orban’s speeches at CPAC. See JD’s comments shilling for Orban.
Ignorance is bliss but also dangerous
→ More replies (2)7
u/concepts_of_a_plan9 14d ago
Hungary truly gives me hope that America can turn around and punish those that brought us here. Seeing Hungary do all this after such autocracy with Orban, really gives me the... hunger.
→ More replies (14)4
u/UMACTUALLYITS23 14d ago
Hate to break it to you but you're only a few months shy of a decade already.
→ More replies (1)24
u/Andisaurus 14d ago
"Have no fear" is one of the most impactful slogans I've seen in a long time. I teared up watching the election. It gives me hope for the future.
25
u/ctgrell 14d ago
That slogan is really what we needed. On election night I was on the train going home and someone sat next to me. She whispered to me "who did you vote for?". And I whispered back "tisza". We were so scared to even talk about it loud and proud. Couple of seats away some asshole started to yell "long live fidesz"" before he left at the next stop. Half hour later I arrived home, still no clue of how the numbers are. I opened the door and my father said "tisza won". I went to my room and started crying from happiness. I don't think I will ever forget that day
→ More replies (3)9
u/RosemaryHoyt 14d ago
I’m honestly so happy for the Hungarian people. You showed the entire world that getting rid of a tyrant can be done, through democratic elections, no less.
5
u/x33storm 14d ago
Not adding anything, just wanna say i'm happy for your country, you deserve good things. Love from Denmark.
12
u/fren_of_frens 14d ago
Must be quite a crazy experience given the change from Orbans regime.
26
u/ctgrell 14d ago edited 14d ago
It took a few weeks to get used to it. My father also yells way less to the tv. There are still some people I see in comment sections who have ptsd and trust issues but they'll come around I'm sure
5
u/shitsu13master 14d ago
I was born Hungarian but raised in Austria so my view of it is skewed. I so hope for Hungary that this guy is the real deal but I am also still having trust issues. So much of him seems completely performative, like he took the name Magyar. How befittingly on the nose.
Yes, he is doing the things he has promised. But will he keep doing them? Everything seems like it’s a dance for the cameras. He supported Orbán for decades after all…
→ More replies (2)12
u/ctgrell 14d ago
So far he seems trustworthy. The last part bothered me too for a while. But I let people grow and change and give them a second chance. Tbh his role back then wasn't bad, he didn't do bad things as far as I know. He drew the line at child molestation. He couldn't let that slide even though his party wanted to get it under the rug. And ever since he didn't stop speaking up and doing what he can wherever he sees problems. I love that for him. He may have been a sheep, but he opened his eyes and rebelled. Let's hope he stays this way. So far he has been honest about everything even if it was to his expense. He is a bit cocky and laughs at his ex party, but fuck, we all do. 16 years of opression. We can have a little laugh. We'll see where our country goes now that we are tasting what freedom feels like
5
u/shitsu13master 14d ago
I really hope that you are right. Hungary has so much potential to be a good example how to turn things around.
I really hope that this guy is Xennial enough to be able to make that bridge. Fingers crossed!
14
u/AuntCatLady 14d ago
My grandparents fled after the failed revolution in the 50s. It killed me watching Orban do what he did to your beautiful country. I’m so glad to see things turning around!
7
u/Masseyrati80 13d ago
Chiming in from Finland: your election result was met with a sigh of relief and an extra cup of coffee to celebrate it over here.
16
u/diedlikeCambyses 14d ago
Wealth taxes are very difficult to implement though. I have read the proposal and it says it wants to break up the large fortunes. As if the mega rich international business entities will sit around and allow that to happen. Exit penalties or not, they'll either flee, or redistribute wealth above a certain point, move future projects away. This matters because how often are you going to tax these unrealised non monetary gains? Once? Annually?
10
u/xeoron 14d ago
USA--> the state Massachusetts did one several years ago. It works like this: if you make over 1 million dollars then everything you make after that million is taxed a few percent points more. This has generated so much for the state it makes community college free and school breakfast/lunches are free for the base meal (want extra or 2nds then you pay). And, the town of Nantucket implemented a rich tax for people that have extra homes there but don't live there nor rent to locals year round. The town has the lowest land tax in the state so taxing those people a little more is still cheaper than elsewhere and that money goes to the towns education program.
22
u/-Sliced- 14d ago
Taxing income (like your MA example) is very different than wealth.
The problem with taxing wealth is that wealth is very mobile. If you have a job that earns you over $1M a year, and live in MA, it’s going to be hard for you to move away and earn a similar amount.
If you have assets and live in MA, you can either move away from there, or move your assets away. That’s not a made up problem, but something we’ve seen happening in places with a wealth tax.
→ More replies (8)9
u/kingjoey52a 14d ago
if you make over 1 million dollars then everything you make after that million is taxed a few percent points more.
That's just income tax. This is why I hate talking about wealth taxes on Reddit, no one actually knows what they're advocating for.
2
2
u/Newcomer31415 14d ago
Especially after you got rid of the Russian puppet. I'm really glad things change for the better in your country!
2
→ More replies (57)2
u/sanavabic 14d ago
Good for you guys. I envy you so much. I was last October in Budapest and it remained in my mind since, have to go back soon. Hopefully my country will start the same path.
115
u/dead97531 14d ago edited 14d ago
The wealth tax will be 1% on assets exceeding 1 billion forints (3.1 million usd).
So if you have 1.1 billion forint, your extra 100 million forint will be taxed by 1%.
100 000 000 * 0.01 = 1 000 000
Edited the math.
25
u/StrebLab 14d ago
$3 million USD seems like a very low threshold for a wealth tax. That would be like late career middle class in the US with a reasonable savings rate. Is that an unusual amount of money in Hungary?
29
u/dead97531 14d ago edited 14d ago
The monthly median gross earnings are 600 000 HUF (1 854 USD),
while the monthly median net earnings are 417 900 HUF (1 291 USD).
If we take Budapest (the capital city) out of the equation, the numbers would get significantly worse.
Edit: Here's a "fun" fact for you: The minimal pension has been 88 USD, since 2008. The new government will increase it to 370 USD in 2027.
46
u/DefiantGibbon 14d ago
Yes.
Average Hungary salary is 9,169,200HUF. Converted to USD that's $28,330.35.
Average US salary is $69,770.
So US salary is about 2.5x more.
So the rough equivalent is they are being taxed on wealth above $7.5mil. Which is a good amount more than most people retire with.
8
u/StrebLab 14d ago
Ok, that makes a lot more sense. I can't imagine a $3 million wealth tax being very popular in the US.
→ More replies (12)11
u/randomnobody14 14d ago
Most Americans would think the tax applies to your entire $3 million instead of the income in excess of that and it would die before ever reaching a vote.
19
u/Astecheee 14d ago
You're waaaay off on your numbers there. A total wealth of $3M USD puts you in the top 3% in America, and the top 1% worldwide. Firmly in the upper class.
In Hungary where the median wage is 22k USD per year, that's an absolutely absurd amount of money.
3
u/CallMeKolbasz 13d ago
Except, quite a number of americans think of themselves as "millionaires in the making", just short of a great business idea to finally become one. Lower and middle class americans are regulary against wealth tax persumably because of this, actually voting against their self-interests.
→ More replies (17)15
u/Newcomer31415 14d ago
So middle class people in America are multi millionaires? I would be very surprised if that was true.
9
u/lunarlunacy425 14d ago
It's such an out of touch take to day that the average middle class American ends up a multimillionaire lmao.
They're just trying to strawan, to make the idea look ridiculous.
3
u/StrebLab 13d ago
No they aren't but they could be if they wanted to be. Most people care more about keeping up with the Joneses than building wealth.
→ More replies (3)→ More replies (3)6
u/potato_nugget1 14d ago
1.1 billion is 100 million extra, so it would be 1 million taxed. But yeah, either way this is good. There are people who are worth 100 billion, this would make them pay 1 billion
→ More replies (1)
690
u/The_Red_Moses 14d ago
Everyone here that is confused about whether wealth taxes are good or bad needs to read Thomas Picketty's "Capital in the 21st Century".
hint: They're good, and the entire worldwide wealthy elite HATES THEM, which is why you get so much pushback against them in a thread like this.
88
u/blinky0930 14d ago
Question. Is it not a possibility that these ppl could move their businesess to other countries? Possibly hurting jobs in Hungary??
84
u/pacomadreja 14d ago
It depends. EU countries usually collaborate between to avoid it, so if they want to do avoid them, they'll probably need to go out of the EU (and none do it, because they don't to lose that market).
→ More replies (1)8
u/Guuggel 14d ago
Yeah good luck with that, Netherlands is applying a new wealth tax and it’s not well received even in Reddit.
22
u/pacomadreja 14d ago
With luck with what? He asked that if rich would change places, and I responded that it's unlikely (based on previous events).
→ More replies (3)→ More replies (1)7
50
u/A_Aub 14d ago
That's one of the reasons we need to make this move in as many rich countries as we can, and soon.
→ More replies (1)14
u/ICLazeru 14d ago
Moving a business is not so straight forward, especially a large business. Think of Tesla for example. It could move it's headquarters easy enough and try to avoid some taxes that way, but how much would it cost Tesla to move a gigafactory? It takes a few years and billions of dollars just to build one, moving it is also going to be expensive. Not only that, but the workforce may not transfer over, so even if you moved the production line, would you have adequately skilled labor to staff it? Also, where would you do business? If Tesla still wants to sell cars to Americans, the transaction will still happen here and be subject to sales tax and the like anyway.
And here's the part I think a lot of people overlook. The benefit we get from these businesses comes mostly from trading with them, not mostly from where the HQ is or where the CEO lives. So even if Tesla wanted to move out of the US, if they still want to make sales in the US market, the US consumer still gets the benefits of that trade.
Billionaires can run away and hide from taxes all they want to, of they want to keep making money, they have to enter the market and trade regardless.
Personally, I think billionaires, considering how fantastic the status quo has been for them, should be a little less hung ho about breaking things and trying to get more. If you own half the ship, you better make sure it doesn't sink.
6
u/dead97531 14d ago edited 14d ago
Nope since these people are part of Orbán's maffia, they are his cronies. Their companies are not competitive internationally. They only exist because Orbán (through the government) funded them
→ More replies (43)3
u/What_a_fat_one 14d ago
No not really. Though depending on industry the answer is "it depends." Are they operating a mining operation? 100% absolutely not, you can't relocate a mine. Are they operating a tech support line? Yeah sure, but they probably already moved it to India.
6
→ More replies (100)3
u/Late-Professional478 14d ago
hint: there bad, very bad. France, Sweden, Germany, The Netherlands, Austria, Denmark, Finland, Luxembourg, Ireland, Iceland all had Wealth taxes and then proceeded to remove them. WHy? When a government implements an annual tax on net worth, mobile capital and high net-worth individuals have a powerful financial incentive to change their legal residency or shift their assets to lower tax jurisdictions.
Governments still need to fund public services, infrastructure, healthcare, and schools. When a chunk of the wealthy tax base disappears, the lost revenue has to be made up somewhere. This frequently leads to higher broad-based taxes that hit middle- and working-class citizens hardest, such as higher value-added taxes (VAT/TVA/sales taxes), increased fuel duties, or higher income tax brackets.
When Rich people eave your taxes go up.
They have tried it in the UK - weve had several thousand tax paying millionaires leave and a few billionaires.
→ More replies (2)4
u/Defender012 14d ago
As someone from Austria fuck off.
The ultra wealthy that might move countries because of the taxes already don't pay taxes because they officially don't have an income higher than minimum wage.
The reason that we have the risk of rich people moving to other countries to escape taxes is because countries are to cowardly and corrupt to make the decision. The more countries tax wealth the more effective it becomes. If taxes were the only incentice to live in a country they'd all live in Dubai
→ More replies (4)
10
u/Canmore-Skate 14d ago
What a crap post, no link, no information.
How much money and what percentages?
→ More replies (2)
131
u/PanteraOne 14d ago
This is the way it should be. Tax wealth, not average earnings.
→ More replies (41)
4
47
u/JustExistingSomehow 14d ago
If I may ask, what prevents the ultra-wealthy from just leaving the country and moving their assets to a tax haven?
14
u/Grouchy_Fan_2236 14d ago
In the case of Hungary - pretty much nothing. It's a tiny, open economy with otherwise rather bad track record in guaranteeing private ownership rights. So the ultra-wealthy may even be better off keeping their wealth in assets of different locations.
In case of countries such as the UK, Sweden or the US: well, it's obvious the wealthy are happy having their assets in these nations, since it's safe, the legal system is trustworthy, banking and financial system has a long history in guaranteeing the value of your assets. It's sort of a public service that pays for itself.
If you were an ultra-wealthy individual would you rather park your money in Hungary or the UK? I think it's a no-brainer.Tax havens are generally against income tax, capital gains taxes or corporate tax. I don't know of any that would be good in blocking wealth tax (since wealth taxes are very rare in the wild).
8
21
u/dawne_breaker 13d ago
Then we raise the taxes in all countries and they have to leave for Mars. Win-win!
→ More replies (19)13
u/SunyiNyufi 14d ago
Hungary is a bit of a special case in this situation imho, because most rich Hungarian CEOs did not get where they are by just doing capitalism, but rather through connections to the previous government. This means that their companies are not on the level to compete internationally and provide for the local market only, and they were mostly used to funnel tax payer's money into private funds.
So even before this wealth tax, an agency has been established to untangle all the ways the previous government turned tax payer money into private money, and take back what we can.
And then for what we can't take back, there will be the wealth tax. Rich people leaving will not be an issue due to them not being the cosmopolitan types in the first place (most of them barely speak English), and should they try to leave, we can still introduce an exit tax if they want to move their operations,
2
u/PublicToast 14d ago
I think you would find that is not a particularly special case, its just capitalism in practice.
→ More replies (3)→ More replies (2)2
u/YoungDiscord 14d ago
Agreed but what I think will happen will be those people just selling their businnesses to mergers or something, then running off abroad with the money they got from it and settle elsewhere before this new regulation comes through
It sucks but hey, at least the upside is that a lot of these people who don't actually know how to run things will be gone and the businnesses will be handed over to more competent people... hopefully
At least that's my prediction
They are already freaking out cuz they can't bribe the governmebt as much as they used to when the previous party was in power.
My biggest concern is the next elections though, people need to take it as seriously as the last election
16
u/odinnagyur 14d ago
You can't exactly move a whole company abroad. You can not move the buildings you own. Sure, the owner might become foreign, but that will not matter, you can easily tax them still. Sure, some things might be moved and hidden, but not everything, that's for sure.
→ More replies (2)3
u/davleb 14d ago
Je suis français et déplacer une entreprise entière à l'étranger, c'est exactement ce qui s'est passé dans mon pays au cours des 30 dernières années. C'est au contraire assez facile. Vous faites une erreur d'analyse que paieront très cher vos enfants (si vous en avez). Je ne soutiens pas les oligarques mais ce type de décision qui fait du bien au premier abord a des conséquences catastrophiques sur le long et moyen terme.
→ More replies (1)3
u/Economy-Effort3445 14d ago
När avundsjukan styr blir det inte bra.
→ More replies (1)3
3
u/DDGBuilder 14d ago
Oftentimes the business that they run is incorporated in their home country
2
u/JustExistingSomehow 14d ago
That's a pretty interesting point. I'm assuming it's pretty difficult to try to switch to a different country when the company is pretty well set in stone.
4
u/Antique-Respect8746 14d ago
Nothing, but the law would probably only last a few years, and also it applies to 2026, so they would have very little time to move their assets, or no opportunity at all depending on how it is drafted - it could include an exit tax.
It's an attempt to claw back the money stolen by the oligarchs via government contracts.
There's also literally only a handful of ultra-wealthy, and it's basically all ill-gotten gains.
→ More replies (2)6
u/Bruggilles 14d ago
That they don't want to live in a shithole country with low taxes. But i guess if they're living in hungary they're already living in a shithole country already lmao (i'm hungarian so i'm allowed to make fun of ourselves)
→ More replies (8)→ More replies (44)14
u/potato_nugget1 14d ago
That's the argument given every single time. If it was true, then every rich person on earth would be in the same country.
14
→ More replies (9)3
u/moo_sweden 14d ago
The world isn’t bland and white. Some leave, some stay. It’s not like there isn’t an influx of very wealthy people to countries like Monaco, Switzerland and USA.
37
u/Lazy_Consequence8838 14d ago
Poor people coming out of the woodwork to defend rich people who wouldn’t care about them
→ More replies (3)9
u/CharlieandtheRed 14d ago
It's absolutely wild how many people likely making ~$60k a year on here defending millionaires and billionaires whenever even the slightest hint of having them pay tax comes up.
→ More replies (3)
4
21
u/ElRanchero666 14d ago
As long as they don't leave, it's simple to move to Dubai or Panama
→ More replies (14)
20
u/4isbetterthan2rhp 13d ago
While I commend them, the rich are the most mobile on the planet. They’ll just move and you’ll lose more than you could have collected. I know this sounds defeatist, but this has been done before and the outcome is real. And no, I don’t have the answer unfortunately
4
u/AllergictoAIslop 13d ago
Yes, I will. And we should sa " f*** you. Keep on moving until the next place taxes you and the next place and the next place. And eventually you can live in the Sahara desert or the Antarctic with all your money."
→ More replies (2)21
u/Vounrtsch 13d ago
Most rich people don’t move once they’re installed even if taxes go up because turns out they can afford it just fine. Taxing the rich works
→ More replies (38)4
u/Signard-versk-Arsten 13d ago
No true, theres been an increase in wealthy people leaving California due to increased taxes and in Australia we are seeing an increase in middle income people leaving due to increased taxation
3
u/Colascape 13d ago
Good it’s about time they have to get a bit uncomfortable while trying to extract from us
5
u/Mind1827 13d ago
Always, always try. There are tons of assets like businesses and land that can't be moved.
→ More replies (1)2
u/gosols 13d ago
In Finland it’s quite common for companies that take off to move their business overseas, i.e. Estonia so they don’t lose so much money to taxes.
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (49)2
52
u/Better_Ad_3004 14d ago
And watch them find a loophole or leave...
55
u/KnowledgeIsDangerous 14d ago
I'm sick of the "they'll just leave" argument.
No they won't. They are used to living or doing business wherever they want, and they can afford to continue doing so even when they're taxed. Because guess what? If you tax the rich they remain rich. They're just greedy and they've convinced the poor that they deserve it.
16
10
u/ASK_ABT_MY_USERNAME 14d ago
Guess who the most mobile class is? That's right the rich, and they do move
https://www.reuters.com/business/norways-wealth-tax-trades-millionaires-equality-2025-11-24/
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/2006/07/16/old-money-new-money-flee-france-and-its-wealth-tax/49ac2ec7-c1b2-423e-a89b-699750275cd4/ (non-paywall https://archive.ph/Q0ETI)
22
u/Pelya1 14d ago
I don’t mean to be rude, but we are talking about Hungary here and rich people.
If you are rich and making money in Hungary - of course you will leave (they left already). And go to
Monaco, Spain, or Singapore/florida. You know- some places with better weather and infrastructure for the rich.27
u/SerenityNow31 14d ago
They often do leave. It happened in the US in California and New York,
→ More replies (8)6
→ More replies (8)3
u/diedlikeCambyses 14d ago
It's not that simple. It's more, future investments and projects will be somewhere else, and pieces of their enterprises will leave. They'll "leave" and even manage to avoid exit fees. This just simply will not produce the revenue it promises.
Also, please answer this.... with wealth taxes on unrealised gains, are they intending to tax it once, or annually. If you think the super wealthy international entities will bow to annually i have a bridge to sell you. If it's once per asset then where's the revenue?
→ More replies (19)13
u/futgrezn 14d ago
Like in Austria where they talk about it again.. but the richest fuckers will just say nah
4
7
u/Beleiverofhumanity 14d ago
This is the 2nd time Ive seen a country do this recently, glad its happening more frequently
6
u/Shadeauxmarie 14d ago
How do they determine wealth ?
→ More replies (1)3
u/Grouchy_Fan_2236 14d ago
The national tax agency will likely procure valuation services from Big4 consulting firms that include shares, property, cash and other asset categories.
Which is obviously a lot more expensive than what the wealth tax will likely pay for.
→ More replies (3)3
20
u/tdkimber 14d ago
there isn’t a single model of this that works to serve the general population as people assume.
lots of great economic videos demonstrating why these models don’t work and require far more fundamental changes to government and taxation
→ More replies (3)
10
u/asteysane 14d ago
I see everyone saying mass evasion is coming next but fuck it, one country needs to set the tone. Others will follow, this issue is widely discussed for several years now and many initiatives amongst the riches are also taking place. Of course some will fight against it, some will evade but hopefully at some point this regulates and they can’t evade anywhere anymore that they already are anyways
5
u/ManOfScience1280 14d ago
Norway tried taxing the wealth by 0.25% and they lost 600 million because all the wealthy left the country. This will not end up well for hungary.
→ More replies (2)
36
u/overzealous_dentist 14d ago
reminder that this is bad populist policy that economists consider economic poison
9
u/thevegit0 14d ago
the usual folk celebrate, then the rich flock away or hide their 'wealth' with loopholes, then the tax falls on the next 'rich' then to middle class and so on, tale as old as time
40
u/Fit_Refrigerator4669 14d ago edited 14d ago
You’re absolutely right. Reddit is full of leftist populists though so it’s very popular in here.
→ More replies (40)5
u/MudBucket 14d ago
Excuse my ignorance, what does this mean?
25
u/No-Understanding9064 14d ago
Its a cash grab not driven by liquidity. Consider how you want to grow an economy. You want money chasing returns in investments in the system. Attempting to tax "wealth" prior to liquidity is actively pulling investment out of your own economy. A government, as a capital allocator, is a poor source of growth.
→ More replies (5)7
20
u/overzealous_dentist 14d ago
populist means appealing to the public (the public in general likes taxing the wealthy, no matter economically silly it is)
historically, wealth taxes result in:
- capital flight (your wealthy move away, taking their businesses and spending with them, making the country poorer and reducing the amount of money flowing to the poor/middle class)
- impossible tax appraisal conditions (how do you valuate a non-public asset?)
- low tax revenue gains
- reduced investment (people see investment as risky in that country, so they just don't invest in the country)
in the past, it's backfired badly enough that almost all countries implementing it have repealed wealth taxes
→ More replies (7)5
u/Duckmastermind1 13d ago
So I'm expected to believe that the company will move to a different country, spending millions in the process, to avoid paying 1% more in taxes?
Most people with companies spend very few in money anyway, they use stocks to leverage a credit that cannot be taxed, the reason why millionaires often pay close to nothing compared to their worth.
Even if they leave, better, let's give space for competition and smaller businesses
And even then, if this would work that way that they will leave and take their money and bankrupt the country, why be more mad about people wanting a change rather then millionaires blackmailing a country to not getting taxed??
It's always "huh, people stupid for wanting to tax millionaires"
And never "huh, millionaires already buy houses and yachts, why not give 1% to pay for a hospital".
6
u/VoidCL 14d ago
!Remind me 10 years
2
u/RemindMeBot 14d ago
I will be messaging you in 10 years on 2036-09-29 21:09:11 UTC to remind you of this link
CLICK THIS LINK to send a PM to also be reminded and to reduce spam.
Parent commenter can delete this message to hide from others.
RemindMeBot is switching to username summons. Instead of
!RemindMe 1 day, useu/RemindMeBot 1 day. More info.
Info Custom Your Reminders Feedback
5
u/FuerteBillete 14d ago
Will they also pass a law that prevents somehow those taxes individuals from just increasing the price on whatever they offer that made them rich?
Because this nonsense of wealth tax works exactly nowhere without also heavy regulation on the prices and once you start with this whole scheme you suddenly are on the wrong side of history
→ More replies (7)
2
2
u/EvenPainting9470 14d ago
Either will not pass or it will pass, but it will affect middle class the most. Remindme! One year
2
u/RedBullBulk1776 14d ago
Haven’t seen anyone in the thread with even a vague understanding of the 16th Amendment. Don’t blame Trump for an amendment that predates his administration by a century.
2
2
2
2
2
2
2
2
2
2
2
2
2
2
2
2
u/ducksrvicious 13d ago
Yes this is fantastic news, it is the only way we get income equality again.
2
u/Lt_Jagtfe 13d ago
Guess its payback time for everyone benefitting over the orban period - looking forward for a new, bright and hopefull hungary! 🇭🇺
5
6
3
12
u/YellowWristBand 14d ago
I really want to know. Why does the rich owe the government money? What does the rich owe the common man money?
9
u/T-rexpro 14d ago
They got 10 million ways to dodge regular taxes while we don't. They owe the government their fair share and it's about time for them to start paying up.
→ More replies (6)8
u/WorriedHovercraft28 14d ago
The way they dodge the taxes is completely legal. Which means it’s the politicians fault for allowing it
7
u/pacomadreja 14d ago
Both. One for actively working on paying less to society, the other for allowing it.
→ More replies (5)3
→ More replies (3)2
u/Batking28 14d ago
It’s a rigged game when the laws are set by politicians being bribed by the rich.
→ More replies (96)10
u/AIienlnvasion 14d ago
Here’s a representative example: the physical toll on roadways rises exponentially with every extra tire added to a vehicle. So 18 wheeler trucks do thousands of times more damage to roads than regular cars. Road upkeep is paid for using tax revenue, so in theory Amazon should be paying much much more than the average company because of how many trucks they use on OUR roads.
Basically, they are reaping rewards from society that far outpaces what they are contributing. They take advantage of (value neutral statement) the laws and protections of the state, and do not pay back a proportionate amount compared to the rest of us who also take advantage of the laws and protections of a state. The wealthy live in a society too, and right now they are gaining much more than would be proportional to their tax contributions.
3
u/PapaOdinson 14d ago
in before shrills suggest we are so very fortunate for their magnanimity to offer us such services
7
u/DIONYSUS_ASMODEUS 14d ago
In the United States, companies with large fleets like Amazon do pay separate, significantly higher road taxes and usage fees compared to common everyday drivers. Because heavy commercial vehicles cause the most wear and tear on infrastructure, the tax system is structured to make them pay more. 1. The Federal Heavy Vehicle Use Tax (HVUT) • The Law: The IRS levies a dedicated Heavy Highway Vehicle Use Tax (via Form 2290). • Threshold: It applies strictly to vehicles with a gross weight of 55,000 pounds or more. • Cost: While standard passenger cars pay $0 for this tax, heavy trucks pay up to $550 annually per vehicle. 2. Disproportionate Funding Contribution • The Share: According to the American Trucking Associations, commercial trucks make up only about 4% of vehicles on US roads. • The Funding: Despite their low vehicle count, they pay nearly 50% of all money going into the federal Highway Trust Fund. • Per-Car Multiplier: On average, a single commercial truck pays 48 times more in road-related taxes than a standard passenger car. 3. State-Level & Fuel Taxes • Commercial Fuel Taxes: Large freight trucks burn diesel, which carries a higher federal excise tax ($0.244 per gallon) than the gasoline used by regular cars ($0.184 per gallon). • Weight-Mile Taxes: Several states charge commercial logistics fleets separate weight-distance taxes based on the exact mileage driven within state lines.
→ More replies (3)→ More replies (19)3
u/DIONYSUS_ASMODEUS 14d ago
There is separate road tax for that,and they do pay it ,companies with large vehicle pays more then common people actually
→ More replies (1)
8
6
3
5
u/No-Call2227 14d ago
The comment sections on this saying wealth tax never ever works with hyperlinked citations are just a wild wild wild outcome of the dead internet.
Who cites sources in arguments on Reddit with an embedded link?
Bold text, hard paragraph forms, it’s so clearly AI response that’s copy pasted by some troll or a bot it’s numbing.
Trying to get on Reddit to build a support against socialized taxes by citing the current European countries that repealed a single part of their tax code as a failure and ignoring a) these are some of the happiest and highest quality of life countries, b) typically noted as the highest levels of equality and freedom, c) almost all function with a proportionate taxation (and high tax brackets), and d) often have a form of democratic socialism is a wild take that this taxation approach doesn’t work.
But also taxation needs to acknowledge a country’s current economic starting point, you don’t play end game socioeconomic rules in a country with a dysfunctional immature economic base, you tax accordingly to balance and build strength and redundancy, and upon maturing it can be modified.
Saying these things failed in Europe is also missing a higher context of the development of the EU and a whole lot of trade laws and other factors.
Plain and simple, if you like defending billionaires, have at it, but you’re pulling one very tiny thread out of a larger sweater without any context and downvoting the hell out of everyone who doesn’t buy your boot licking sentiment full sale.
→ More replies (2)8
u/Tjessx 14d ago
Not defending billionaires, but this won't change a thing for Hungary (in the positive sense).
There aren't really that many wealthy people. This 1% tax brings in basically nothing and possibly even less than It costs to pass this law. And it obviously deincentives growing your business, investing, building wealth and keeping your money into a country that taxes in this way. This will slow down growth, drive away at least some wealthy people and businesses and will be a net negative for the country.
The result will be to increase the tax and to lower the minimum wealth on which it applies which will drive this result even further into a negative→ More replies (5)
2
•
u/BeAmazed-ModBot Subreddit Bot 14d ago
Did you find this post really amazing (in a positive way)?
If yes, then UPVOTE this comment otherwise DOWNVOTE it.
This community feedback will help us determine whether this post is suited for r/BeAmazed or not.