r/AskAChristian • u/Elegant_Abalone_2344 Agnostic • 2d ago
Televised execution?
Would a Christian watch this execution if it’s televised or live streamed? As a non religious person I will not and I find the whole idea nauseating and horrific. This is something that North Korea does. But anyway, would you watch?
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u/FarmerForChrist Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
No. We are becoming desensitized to violence. This just further advances it. Capital punishment is meant to be a deterrent not a spectacle. Instead this is making it a sideshow.
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u/beardslap Atheist 2d ago
Capital punishment is meant to be a deterrent not a spectacle.
And yet it doesn't even succeed at that.
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u/CaptainTelcontar Christian, Protestant 2d ago
The fact that it's hidden is probably a big part of why it's not much of a deterrent in the US. There's a reason why it's been a somber public ceremony throughout all human history.
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u/HistoricalHat4847 Christian 2d ago
Baloney.
Public executions were often attended for spectacle entertainment in the past. In fact, for primarily that reason. Crucifixion, included.
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
Absolutely not, this is insanity.
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u/johndoe09228 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago edited 2d ago
I agree, the energy around the execution is what’s weird as well. Very performative and gleeful, people I’ve heard saying this is a “blessed” or “God-given” idea. Others explicitly saying that this will set an example, even kids could access the broadcast.
That feels way weirder than just the fact somebody got death penalty
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u/HistoricalHat4847 Christian 2d ago
As a Christian religious person, I will not and also find the whole idea nauseating and horrific.
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u/HistoricalHat4847 Christian 1d ago
Habakkuk 2:4 "Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith."
Romans 1:17 "For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith."
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u/AWCuiper Agnostic 1d ago
It is not only nauseating it is also pure political stupidity; creating a martyr and enflaming Muslim terrorists. Stupidity, as is so much that this administration does.
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u/HistoricalHat4847 Christian 1d ago
The potential for igniting widespread martyrdom is particularly troubling against the performative relish with which this un-Christian administration is going about this.
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u/AWCuiper Agnostic 1d ago
Hegseth cs proclaim to be real Christians. What are we to think about what Christianity is, then? Who decides, and when?
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u/HistoricalHat4847 Christian 1d ago
Jesus, Himself, warns us that there will be "wolves" among us, recognized specifically by their "fruits", and that many believers will be mislead by them. There is no question in my mind that those "fruits", while always having been present to threaten Christianity, are now being manifested in the extreme by nationalism cloaked in its name. Paul, further on, also warns that "wolves" will come in among us, and here we are.
Calling yourself whatever you want without following the precepts of the religion itself, makes you only an imposter, regardless of how much interpretation is twisted to justify action. This is true for all belief systems and those that do so, usually fall into the category of a cult.
There is much to being a Christian, but if you read The Olivet Discourse (The Sermon on the Mount), Jesus makes it straightforward, making clear that the wolves, indeed, are among us now.
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u/Great-Ad1839 Christian, Catholic 2d ago
Heck, no. This is a prime example just how violence has become desensitized by the world and how morally bankrupt people have become
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u/-NoOneYouKnow- Christian 2d ago edited 2d ago
I am a Christian and I will not watch. I'm opposed to the death penalty in all cases, even when I feel like someone deserves it.
Countries that have carried out public executions in the last ten years are limited to Iran, Afghanistan, and Yemen. Three countries controlled by religious fanatics. This is who we are now.
I've been hearing the Religious Right in the US calling for more executions and public executions since the late 1980's. We have a whole generation of evangelicals that have been told this will make things better and that it's what God wants.
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u/AWCuiper Agnostic 1d ago
The Christian Right loves Violence and the Old Testament. They speak more about Righteousness than about Love.
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u/Specialist_Salsa Christian 2d ago
In my opinion, televising it brings fame or infamy to the shooter. While not necessarily against the death penalty, and certainly not in this case, I think it is over the line.
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u/_ThatCuriousFellow_ Christian 2d ago
Someone can make certain foolish choices and still be a Christian.
Regardless of where one stands on whether or not a Christian should watch it, it doesn’t necessarily serve as evidence of their faith or lack thereof.
Now, if someone who claimed to be Christian enjoyed the execution, that is something that would certainly give me pause.
All that being said, I have absolutely no intention of being a witness to a public execution, even if the offender is a criminal of the highest order. If someone dear to me were murdered by said criminal, I might reconsider.
Fortunately, I do not currently find myself in that particular scenario.
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u/Casingdacat Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
No. I have no desire to watch such a gruesome spectacle. It’s bad enough to see it happen in a movie, where it’s not even real. No thanks. We aren’t all barbarous people. Not all of us are inclined to, or even desire to, be MAGA “Christians”, who seem to be the ones people are assuming are in favor of it.
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u/ThoDanII Catholic 2d ago
The death penalty is forbidden by the pope
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u/Sofa_King_Chubby Christian 2d ago
The pope doesn’t oversee Christianity, just Catholics.
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u/One-Possible1906 Christian, Protestant 2d ago
I think it’s fair to agree with the pope on this one
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u/kmm198700 Christian 2d ago
Amen. I’m not Catholic and the pope seems very reasonable and kind and truly seems to love his neighbors
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u/Geeb16 Confessional Lutheran 2d ago
The Church has been accepting of the death penalty for thousands of years until recently.
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u/One-Possible1906 Christian, Protestant 2d ago
Churches have been imperfect since their inception. We should be modeling the teachings of Christ, not the teachings of men, even those who loved Christ. All men are imperfect.
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u/-NoOneYouKnow- Christian 2d ago
Growth is good. When an entity recognizes past wrongs and works to not repeat them, it's a positive thing.
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u/CaptainTelcontar Christian, Protestant 2d ago
The pope isn't in charge of all of Christianity, just the Catholics. And the Roman Catholic Church has supported the death penalty until quite recently.
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u/Defiant-Map-7424 Christian 2d ago edited 2d ago
At the foot of Christ's cross, there were also Christians of that time and even an apostle witnessing His execution; the difference, in this case, is that Jesus was innocent.
There is no sin in witnessing an execution, and no one is obliged to watch, but I find it natural that victims' families and upstanding citizens might wish to witness the end of the person who caused so much harm.
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u/AustinRatBuster Christian 2d ago
innocence doesnt matter. remember the theif on the cross? he wasnt innocent but was forgiven on the spot
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u/Defiant-Map-7424 Christian 2d ago
Repentance and forgiveness restores innocence, the repentant thief was born again by the grace of God.
Jesus declared, "I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again" (John 3:3)
"Truly I say to you, unless you turn and become like little children, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven" (Matthew 18:3)
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u/Inevitable-Copy3619 Agnostic Christian 2d ago
This just shows how much of our disgust is socially driven. In earlier times crowds would watch them live, crowds who were largely Christian. None of us would care to see that but it was good Christian retributive justice in other times.
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u/OlasNah Atheist, Secular Humanist 2d ago
It was? I’d say the lion’s share of those executions were of people who had not committed any serious crime
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u/Inevitable-Copy3619 Agnostic Christian 2d ago
Yeah agreed. I’m saying public executions err considered ethical and something “good Christians” accepted. That’s why I say our current disgust isn’t because of God teaching us morality, it’s that society simply has a different ethic today. It’s societally driven not Gos driven like the Christians here are trying to make it seem.
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
In those same times those same Christians were doing horrible things to people. I wouldnt call them good christians. I don't think my disgust is socially driven, I think I'm just not desensitised to cruelty and violence like they would have been - thus, I am disgusted.
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u/Inevitable-Copy3619 Agnostic Christian 2d ago
And that is socially driven! You just defined it. Our culture is sensitive to death and violence, moreso than previous cultures. We are influenced by the culture around us, it’s inevitable…and very human.
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u/Traditional_Emu_4332 Questioning 2d ago
Are we sensitive to death and violence though? Look at our entertainment (movies, tv shows, video games). I thought we were pretty desensitized to viewing violence. I could be wrong. Some people choose not to watch violence on their screens. 🤷♀️
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u/Inevitable-Copy3619 Agnostic Christian 2d ago
I think we are. What is on the screen is not what is reality. We can watch graphic representations of violence and death but most of modern society would be repulsed by a live in person hanging. But that seemed to be a social event in medieval times, and even into the American west.
We don’t want to watch live executions anymore not because we are advanced morally (maybe we are) but because our culture and time is repulsed by violence and death in real life. It’s a culturally driven preference.
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
I choose to watch violence in tv all the time, none of that translates whatsoever to the real world because I am a sane person. The second it's real life, real people, I recoil. If you don't do the same because of fiction desensitising you then you are consuming way too much fiction and not processing that healthily. Most people have a strong distinction between pretend and reality
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u/Traditional_Emu_4332 Questioning 2d ago
Yeah, I guess you’re right. I didn’t think of it that way.
I saw watching the Lindsey Clancy trial as tough for me to confront. Especially since I experienced post partum psychosis and almost hurt one of my children! 👶 (but I guess that’s off the subject)2
u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
Definitely off topic but the Lindsey Clancy trial was so sad, really overwhelmed me as well. Its such a complicated situation
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
I don't think we are on the same page. I don't think we are sensitive because our culture is more sensitive. I think in order to not be repulsed by violence, we need to be desensitised by huge amounts of it. We still this all over the world, and in fact I believe the powers that be are actively trying to desensitise us again. But if we live more naturally, not seeing huge injustice and violence on a regular basis, then our minds can think more clearly and we feel disgust. We should be sensitive to cruelty. I believe that is how we are meant to be. I'm not disgusted because people around me are, I'm disgusted because I can empathise and think critically about the world.
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u/-NoOneYouKnow- Christian 2d ago
We're in growth. Sure, religious conservatism is working overtime to make us more barbarous and cruel, but on the whole, western culture is becoming more humane.
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u/Inevitable-Copy3619 Agnostic Christian 2d ago
I would agree! But it sure seems we are on an arc toward better treatment of humans and the world around us. We have a long way to go but this may be the best we have been, for better or weeks?
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u/CountSudoku Christian, Protestant 2d ago
I assume you're referring to the public execution of Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan.
I don't think it's wrong for a Christian to watch it, but I personally won't.
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u/Dawningrider Christian, Catholic 2d ago
No.
But I wouldn't even be surprised if some MAGA school teacher decides to show it to the classroom for being "educational".
Defence being kids saw public hangings back in the day.
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u/Beautiful_Day_2497 Christian, Anglican 2d ago
No, it’s barbaric. The whole civilised world is looking on in shock and horror at what’s happening over there. Dystopian
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u/XenKei7 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
I have no interest in seeing this execution.
The only time I'd ever consider watching a public execution, is if the person in question murdered someone close to me. I'd consider seeing it to see justice served. Yet even then, I'm still not entirely sure I'd go.
If someone watches or not doesn't determine how good a Christian they are, though.
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u/ScrewedUp4Life Christian 2d ago
I'm sure the Christian nationalists who worship trump have no problem with it.
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u/TheaBeleva Messianic Jew 2d ago
I won’t be watching. I’ve seen enough violence in my lifetime.
I did once watch an ISIS beheading because I resolved that if one day I’d have to be martyred, I should have some concept of what it means. I also thought I should witness a fellow believer’s steadfast refusal to renounce their faith. It was pretty hard to watch, I was shaky and nauseous after and anytime I remember it I can still see it vividly.
I hope the American government is tasteful in its presentation of the execution, rather than gratuitous.
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u/songbolt Christian, Catholic 2d ago
I dunno, I might, but I probably won't tune in or seek it out. Good to pray for him to repent...
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
How about you pray for the people executing him to repent? Like hello? He's evil, but that doesnt make any of this okay.
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u/Fanghur1123 Agnostic 2d ago edited 2d ago
Just when I think I couldn't possibly despise the Trump regime and its enablers any more than I already do, they keep finding ways to surprise me.
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u/AWCuiper Agnostic 1d ago
Oh and do not forget selling Ukraine to Putin. There will be more to follow.
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u/songbolt Christian, Catholic 2d ago
Executing a murderer for the protection of society is not a sin.
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
If it was for the protection of society it would NOT be broadcast to society.
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u/songbolt Christian, Catholic 2d ago
Straw man fallacy
Execution and broadcasting are two separate questions; I spoke of the former.
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
Jesus says let he without sin cast the first stone, and those who live by the sword die by the sword. We don't have an answer to this specific circumstance but where in Jesus' teachings about peace do you get "murdering murderers is good"
Regardless of your religious opinion, we separate church and state because that is necessary. A system that allows execution is always a flawed system, innocents always get caught in it, it doesn't matter if it's 1% of cases. It is still a flawed system that innocents have and will always die in. It also works out more expensive than life in prison, which means resources are wasted just to end someone. It's the emotional response, not the ethical or rational one.
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u/AWCuiper Agnostic 1d ago
The Christian Right loves Violence. So who are the true Christians? Who is there to determine that?
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u/E-Reptile Atheist 2d ago
(Note that I'm not referring to this specific execution, just in general)
Is executing someone who was, in fact, innocent of the crimes charged against him, a sin?
(Assume the executioners do not know any better, and operate under the assumption he's guilty)
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u/songbolt Christian, Catholic 2d ago
any of this
Murderers waive their right to life: Capital punishment is morally legitimate if necessary for the good of society.
It's a prudential question whether it's still needed for technologically-advanced countries.
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
Except it isn't for the good of society, it's both frowned upon by Jesus and it's a failed system that inevitably hurts innocents. It's also more expensive to execute someone than to give them life in jail.
Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.
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u/NDelecti Atheist, Secular Humanist 1d ago
Ah, that would be YOUR morals you refer to. Don't assume that everyone shares your incapacity.
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u/songbolt Christian, Catholic 1d ago
You're r/lostredditors for r/AskReddit
I'm giving the teaching of the Church for this forum.
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u/Sofa_King_Chubby Christian 2d ago
In the Old Testament, the law did not view watching an execution as a sin or a morbid vice; rather, it was a structured part of the justice system. For capital offenses—such as murder, idolatry, or blasphemy—the prescribed method of punishment was often public stoning.
The community was required to gather, watch, and even participate by throwing stones to "purge the evil" from their midst (Deuteronomy 21:21).
The legal witnesses whose testimony convicted the criminal were legally mandated to cast the very first stones (Deuteronomy 17:7). Refusing to follow through with the justice system would have been considered a failure of societal duty, not a sin.
The Bible explicitly states that executions were meant to be observed so that the public would internalize the consequences of breaking the law. Passages like Deuteronomy 19:20 note that when justice is carried out publicly, "The rest of the people will hear and be afraid, and never again will such an evil thing be done among you." In this context, being a witness to the execution was the exact mechanism God prescribed to deter future sins.
In the New Testament, thousands of people witnessed public executions carried out by the Roman Empire, including the crucifixion of Jesus.
The Gospels detail that Jesus’ disciples, his mother Mary, and many other followers stood by and watched him die (Luke 23:49). The Bible never condemns these onlookers for sinning by watching; their presence is treated with grief, solemnity, or historic record, but never as a transgression.
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago edited 5h ago
Public executions were technically in the Bible and there were no issues.
I'll probably check out a recording. I personally don't think there's anything sinful with doing it.
I think a better question is, "Is there any verse someone can use to justify it being wrong? And even then, why would someone who's not a Christian be against it, unless there's some objective moral standard that says it's bad?"
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u/Lovebeingadad54321 Atheist 2d ago
As someone who is not a Christian I can talk to your last question. Obviously I need to preface this with the statement that there are a vast number of views that are non-Christian, and I don’t speak for all Non-Christians.
The objective moral standards only come into play once you have established your subjective moral goal. If the goal is to cause the least amount of human suffering possible, then the death penalty goes against this principle. Televising the execution even more so.
If your subjective moral goal is simple obedience to an authority, then if that authority orders the death penalty, or even public executions, then that is the objective moral action to Meet your goals, regardless of the additional suffering it causes.
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago edited 2d ago
If all goals are subjective, then there are none and standards don't exist as well. It is the same as saying, "this is right/wrong because I said so."
That doesn't get anyone anywhere in the long run.
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u/beardslap Atheist 2d ago
If all goals are subjective, then there are none and standards don't e ist as well
They 'exist' as social constructs, we made them up.
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago
Which means they aren't real. If something requires you to make it, then someone else can just make something else and override it, if they're stronger.
Under that logic, if Hitler won and wiped out everyone who was against him, then his idea that all Jews should die would be correct as that's the current social construct.
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u/Lovebeingadad54321 Atheist 2d ago
Saying God made them up doesn’t solve the problem that t hey are just the random thoughts of a being and therefore not objective. It just means you believe God is stronger than Hitler and you are only following them because you believe because God is more powerful, then his morals should be correct.
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago
That's making a few assumptions. Christians don't believe God made up rules. Rather, he established them on his unchanged nature. For objective morality to exist, it must be founded on something that can't change, and that's what God did.
Also, no one is following God rather than Hitler just because God is stronger. Well, perhaps some do, but you're not going to find many people who say that's why they follow God over Hitler.
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u/Lovebeingadad54321 Atheist 2d ago
So morality is subjective to the nature of God.
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago edited 2d ago
Only if Gods nature can change. Morality requires a will and objective morality requires something that can't change. God's nature is both willing (He's a personal being) and immutable (it can't change), so morality grounded in it is both grounded in a will and objective.
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u/Lovebeingadad54321 Atheist 2d ago
Why does morality require a will? And why do you believe God incapable of change?
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u/beardslap Atheist 2d ago
Which means they aren't real.
So government, education and money aren't real either?
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago
Those aren't related to the topic of morality. We're talking about standards. Specifically, if objective ones can exist. You mentioned goals, my point boils down to the fact that if everyone can make their own goals, then all goals are equally valid, which means no goals really matter in the end.
And if no goals matter, then basing morals on them also has no point and who's right would just become who's stronger and can enforce their goals and morals better than anyone else, hence Hitler could be seen as correct if he won and wiped out opposition.
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u/see_recursion Skeptic 2d ago
What makes you think there are objective moral standards?
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago
Let's assume there aren't any, why bother acting like things are right and wrong if it's all a matter of opinion?
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u/see_recursion Skeptic 2d ago
You were arguing for an objective moral standard. Maybe you subsequently realized you don't have an argument for one?
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago
Well I believe there is one. My point is, if there isn't one, what point is there debating if something is right or wrong as if it exists.
For instance, do you believe in an objective standard outside human opinion?
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u/see_recursion Skeptic 2d ago
There are definitely objective standards outside of human opinion. The definition of a meter, for example, is an objective standard. It was subjectively specified by minds and is now an objective standard.
Morals, however, come from minds. If yours come from the mind of your deity then they're subjective.
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago
You are correct, if God decided what is right and wrong on a whim, then they would be subjective.
Most christians who have looked into that issue, myself included, point out that God established morality on his unchanging nature, rather than making up rules.
So that brings me back to my point before. If God doesn't exist and there was nothing unchanging I'm aware of that morality could have been established with, therefore, no standard and no point in debating what's right and wrong. It only makes sens if there IS a standard somewhere.
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u/see_recursion Skeptic 1h ago
Does your objective moral standard include that it's ok to beat your slaves as long as they don't die within a day or two? Is that objectively ok, or do you subjectively say "oh, hell no!"?
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u/PewdsForPresidnt Christian 2d ago
because there are objective moral standards. for example, orcas kill for fun, but they will never kill their own child for fun, whys that? its immoral. just like killing your own kid would be immoral. its built into you, everyone on earth has that and its not taught
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u/Beautiful_Day_2497 Christian, Anglican 2d ago
Do we live under the old covenant or the new covenant? Jesus, when faced with someone whose crime commanded the death penalty, said “Let whoever is without sin cast the first stone” which means, no one can. Only he qualified for that, and instead he showed mercy. That’s New Testament, and that tells us everything we need to know about how to act as Christians
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago edited 2d ago
You may want to read that story again, the issue was not just that the death penalty was bad:
- The Torah demanded death for both the adulterer and adulteress (Lev 20:10, Deut 22 :22). Since only the woman was brought, stoning just her was not authorized.
2. The Jewish leaders at that time had no authority to carry out capital punishment, only Rome did (as seen in John 18 :31). This was a mob trap and not an actual legal proceeding.
- And we know it was a trap because John 8:6 says "they said this, testing him." If he endorsed stoning, he went against Rome; if he refused, he appeared to contradict Moses.
So this verse, "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone" is about witness disqualification, not removal of capital punishment. Under Deuteronomy 17:7, it was the witnesses who cast the first stones, and that wasn't these men.
He essentially dodges the real by pointing out they were in the wrong by trying to get her killed in an improper method. In modern times he would say this case was, "dismissed for lack of jurisdiction and improper witnesses."
Also, that who event with Jesus and the woman isn't in the earliest manuscripts, so there's debate on of it should even be in the Bible.
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u/Beautiful_Day_2497 Christian, Anglican 1d ago
Sounds like you’ve sucked all the soul out of the gospels in favour of legalism
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u/Kalmaro Christian 1d ago
If that's another way of saying that I'm being true to the scriptures, then sure. I don't like adding to the Bible something that's not there or taking away from it, that's how you get denominations.
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u/Beautiful_Day_2497 Christian, Anglican 1d ago
It’s not, I think you’re wrong about your analysis, but my point here is saying be careful not to fall into the same trap as the Pharisees, caught up in the technicalities of the law, whilst missing the heart of God - He desires mercy over judgement, and he wants us to show mercy to one another too. Sadistically engaging in spectacle of violence and murder, even of evil people, is not something we as Christians should be doing.
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u/Kalmaro Christian 1d ago
Well, a few things.
Sadistic implies that we're taking some kind of pleasure. I don't take pleasure from seeing someone get executed, but I do take satisfaction knowing justice is happening. Much like, say, a family member of someone who was murdered may watch an execution for closure. Pleasure has nothing to do with this, not for me anyway.
You're accusing me of technicalities of the law, but what you should be doing is proving I'm wrong. I showed how the verse provides doesn't fit the argument. Rather than just say I'm wrong, can you show I'm mistaken? If not then now were just getting into opinions outside the Bible.
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u/Beautiful_Day_2497 Christian, Anglican 21h ago
Because you’re saying Jesus is just trying to get out of a trick question, whilst offering no spiritual wisdom. This interaction is not just about dancing around technicalities to get off the hook, none of these moments with the Pharisees were. He clearly does both, He doesn’t fall into their traps *and* He astounds them with profound spiritual wisdom. That wisdom is the heart of it all, and it’s what drew people to Him. Let us remember how Jesus calls us to be - He calls us to love our enemies, forgive 70x7, for mercy over sacrifice. In this light, how do we love our enemies? By killing them? Depriving them of the opportunity to repent? Or do we show them mercy, and tell them to turn from their sin?
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u/Kalmaro Christian 18h ago
The wisdom is that he shows they were trying to abuse the law and were hypocrites and he could tell. Rather than fall for thier trap, he used the very law they were trying to use against him.
Which he does often in the scriptures when it came to those leaders. Often, he's just pointing out how they misuse the law and are hypocrites. I see that as pretty wise myself.
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u/Beautiful_Day_2497 Christian, Anglican 14h ago
If there’s one thing the Pharisees understood, it was the law. If the stoning was unlawful Biblically, Jesus could’ve explained that and it would’ve caused no controversy, no tension between holding to the law of Moses or the Romans. So the fact He said something so different, and instead called for them to look upon their own sin before they condemn another tells us something about the heart of God. His heart for mercy and grace.
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u/PNWJesusFreak Christian Universalist 2d ago
Verse? That's not how Jesus taught his disciples. He didn't try to pull out a verse to justify his every teaching. In fact, he often emphasized that his way goes beyond the letter of the law. If we are his disciples, we should do likewise. There is no holy purpose for viewing bloodshed as entertainment.
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago
Who said anything about entertainment? And like I said, God himself authorized stonings, which were public affairs, in the old testament.
Obviously, that was for the Jews, but he never said the public viewing itself was bad, and since there's no verse that says it's wrong there's no way to justify saying it's a sin to watch that I can see.
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u/PNWJesusFreak Christian Universalist 2d ago
There may be nothing to forbid it, but is that truly the most God honoring way you can think of to spend that hour or however long it will take you to watch it?
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u/WhiteHeadbanger Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
God's Law (aside from the moral one) were regulations for people with a certain specific historic context, relative to other nations around them. Take for instance the slavery thing, it's a regulation, as well as the stoning. It's not that God condones both.
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago
One could argue that, the only issue is that when it comes to the old laws verses the new laws, the new laws make a point of clarifying things. Take slavary for example. In the new testament it's made clear that we are ALL equal under God. That had the effect of removing the lines between slave and master and gradually, over time, it's now seen as a massive taboo. It's extremely difficult to argue that God wants slavery to be a thing by using the Bible.
You can use that for other things in the older testament as well. Essentially, every law that's relevant for us today was also mentioned later.
Public executions are never mentioned in the new testament and there's nothing I'm aware of that hints at it either. Because of that, I see no way to justify that they are sinful to watch. Something like that falls into a gray area where youd have to use your own judgement and if it goes against your beliefs, you likely shouldn't do it.
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u/ToyshopASMR Christian 2d ago
Slaves were told to obey their masters. Should we still enforce that?
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u/Kalmaro Christian 2d ago
You can't just take one thing. AT that time, yes, slaves were told to obey their masters. Masters were also told that they weren't above their slaves and that we were all equal under God.
When you also factor in the other rules fro christians, which speak out against llying, murder, doing to others as you want to be done to you, violence outside of defending yourself and other things, what you're left with is someone you scripturally can't abuse and someone you have to treat honestly.
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
It's as if you're quoting Jesus! Oh wait, no never mind, he was against executions, my bad. If you're so against terrorism, then maybe you should be against everything the republican party is doing right now, including this.
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u/6comesbefore7 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago edited 2d ago
Mat 5:21 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
Kill in the Greek is murder
Judgement is death
Exo 21:12 He that smiteth a man, so that he die, shall be surely put to death.
The Marxist left and the RINOS are the problem
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
You're quoting exodus to defend US public executions? Really? Tell me, what parts of exodus do you live by and which parts do you reject now? Talk about cherry picking!
Jesus himself said let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Now, religion aside, as should be done in politics and authority leading the country, execution is a terrible slippery slope. Public execution is a recipe for dystopian disaster. Wake the hell up.
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u/6comesbefore7 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
I don’t need to justify anything to you, like I pointed out to you that Jesus Christ said thou shalt not murder and judgment is execution. I only believe that execution should be when there is indisputable proof that murder has happened! Tell me would want a serial child molester that has been terrorizing little girls and murdering them be executed or just put in prison and maybe get parole .
[Jhn 8:7](verseid:43.8.7) So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.
None them were murders , and has nothing to do with murder
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
In my emotions I would 100% be fine with a child predator getting the death penalty, some of those people are in positions of power. In my rational state, I don't think the death penalty should be legal, because no matter how much you want there to be indisputable proof, people HAVE been and are still being wrongly executed. Whether it is 1% or 10% or 50% of people is irrelevant, if one innocent is killed, it's a failed system. So I am against it, and I am for harsh prison sentencing. Child abusers should get life in jail no parole. In my spiritual state, we should not be killing anyone, we are called to live in peace. Not violence. Even if someone deserves it, even if that's what we think.
Whether or not this despicable human being is executed is completely irrelevant. The death penalty is a failed system, but this man is guilty. The issue here is public televised execution. The powers at be are choosing this. Why do you think they're doing this now? We are on a dark road.
And FYI, Jesus said let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Not don't murder, I'm explicitly quoting him saying no to the public execution of a guilty woman. And if you want to defend the executions in the old testament, we absolutely can get into that, because they're WRONG and you are cherry picking the hell out of those books.
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u/6comesbefore7 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
And I made my point that there has to be indisputable evidence, and now you are saying that a child molester should be executed. When it is televised people will have second thoughts on what they do.
Jhn 8:8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground
When he wrote on the ground he pointing out there sins
Jhn 8:9 And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.
I’m sure you don’t need a understanding on this
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
I explicitly said they shouldn't be, because if the system allows that then it will cause huge issues - because there is no perfect system that allows executions. You say you want undeniable evidence, but courts can be corrupt and the system isn't basing it on undeniable evidence- it's based on the jury.
You're now saying that we should have televised public executions to scare people out of violence. Violence to deter violence. What was it that Jesus said about living by the sword? Who cares, you can just ignore those verses and cherry pick!
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u/6comesbefore7 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
Violence to deter Violence, you mean punishment to deter Violence 😉
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
No, I mean violence. Because killing someone is violent, regardless of context.
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u/Automaton17 Christian, Ex-Atheist 2d ago
The republican parties are televising executions?
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u/6comesbefore7 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
Don’t watch it, no one is forcing anyone to watch it
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
Oh alright. Lets play that game. Don't you dare complain about gay marriage, trans women playing in women's sports, vaccines or abortions. After all, no one is forcing you to watch it.
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u/6comesbefore7 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
I stand against everything you said! I’ll stand with God & Jesus and you can stand with Satan
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
Stop complaining, you don't have to watch it!
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u/6comesbefore7 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
You’re right I don’t have to watch it but I can stand against it. I’ll stand against all evil and you can support it
[Isa 5:20](verseid:23.5.20) Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!
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u/Jane_TGS Christian 2d ago
You're right, we don't have to watch the public execution, but we can stand against it. I'll stand against dystopian evil shit and you can support it.
Woe to those who call evil good and good evil!
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u/6comesbefore7 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago edited 2d ago
The subject was your gay crap , abortions, trans people and vaccines, and Jesus is against that.
Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Sorcerers in the Greek is Pharmakeus where we get the word pharmacy
φαρμακεύς
pharmakeus
far-mak-yoos'
From φάρμακον pharmakon (a* drug, that is, spell giving potion); *a druggist (“pharmacist”) or poisoner, that is, (by extension) a magician\: - sorcerer.→ More replies (0)
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u/CaptainTelcontar Christian, Protestant 2d ago
This is something that North Korea does.
Public executions are something that has been normal in all civilizations throughout human history, except in the west for the past century or so. They serve as a somber warning to remind people that there are consequences to their actions.
As for whether this one should be livestreamed, I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, our society desperately needs some hard reminders that they're accountable for their actions, and more deterrents against doing terrible things. On the other hand, I think a lot of potential viewers will take a very unhealthy attitude of revenge-like pleasure in watching it.
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u/VaporRyder Christian 2d ago edited 2d ago
It's biblical and just.
I watched Saddam Hussein hang, and may watch the jihadist that turned upon his own unarmed colleagues, butchering them in cold blood, receive the penalty due to him.
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u/Bootsy_boot23 Christian, Ex-Atheist 2d ago
I was young when he was caught, but I thought he was shot by the seal team that gained access to his house? 😅
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u/VaporRyder Christian 2d ago
That was Bin Laden. The US gave SH to the Iraqi authorities and they hanged him.
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u/feelZburn Christian 2d ago
That was Osama bin Laden of the al-Queda terrorist organization.
Saddam Hussein was the dictator of Iraq.
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u/AustinRatBuster Christian 2d ago
this guy wouldve been eating popcorn while jesus was on the cross
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u/Bootsy_boot23 Christian, Ex-Atheist 2d ago
Jesus didn’t deserve what happened to Him. But we put Him there. There is literally no comparison to Jesus and this man… The people who died by this man’s hands didn’t deserve it, a mom, BEGGING FOR HER LIFE, but he still killed her. This man is receiving what the law of the land is ordering. 🤷🏽♀️ some are fine with seeing justice be served, in this fashion, some aren’t. If you cannot handle it, don’t watch it. It’s not a sin to watch. 🙄
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u/AustinRatBuster Christian 2d ago
He who is without sin cast the first stone
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u/Bootsy_boot23 Christian, Ex-Atheist 2d ago
And God will give him his eternal judgment, and the law of the land will give him his earthly judgment. 🤦🏽♀️
Should we not give equal punishment to criminals? Or should we just pop them on the hand? Or should we just say, “ahh. Bc I’m a sinner, I can’t say anything about you doing this, sooo you’re free to go!!”?? 🤦🏽♀️🙄
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u/AustinRatBuster Christian 2d ago
What happened to the thief on the cross
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u/Bootsy_boot23 Christian, Ex-Atheist 2d ago
…he was on the cross… for his crimes… and he asked Jesus for salvation.. Jesus told him that he would be with Him in paradise… buuut the sentence was served… death.
it’s between Nidal and Jesus where Nidals soul ends up, not us… but like the thief on the cross, justice is to be served…the thief committed a crime that, at the time, was punishable by death, and he faced his execution… Nidal committed a crime, punishable by death, and he’s to face execution…
that’s how the law of the land works. Laws are set, method of punishment set, if laws are broken, then the punishment is served… 🤦🏽♀️
I truly pray Nidal finds faith in Jesus and he asks Him for forgiveness, but I have no say in it.
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u/AustinRatBuster Christian 2d ago edited 2d ago
Vengeance belongs to God. I dont trust this lying and murderous state. There was even a failed execution recently. But does the government care? No. They're gonna try to kill her again as soon as if she recovers because the states lust for murder is unquenchable
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u/CannedNoodle415 Eastern Orthodox 2d ago
This was normal even a few hundred years ago, for millenia. It might seem brutal or gruesome but this is from the shelter of our 2026 lives where we get offended by pronouns.
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u/E-Reptile Atheist 2d ago
I mean, I can list a whole lot of other things that used to be normal a few hundred years ago that you're not going to want to bring pack.
It's ok to leave something like this behind
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u/AnKap_Engel Christian, Protestant 2d ago
I find it to be crazy to televise the execution. However the execution itself, I believe is justified as the man was convicted for the murder of 13 people and attempted murder of 32 others.
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u/tremble_lip Christian 2d ago
I would watch. It's not a sin to understand what is happening around you. It could even be important for people to watch; watch and be ready.
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u/user0987234 Christian 2d ago
Watch and be ready for what??
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u/tremble_lip Christian 1d ago
Jesus gave some warnings about what to look for before his return. One of them was that the "love of many will grow cold" and, "if they do this in a green tree, what will they do when the tree is dry" (as he was being crucified).
He also suggested that while he doesn't give an exact date for his return, his followers should not be confused like someone caught by a thief in the night.
His warning concluded with an admonishment to vigilantly watch.
To me, it seems like a public execution fits with the love of many growing cold, especially since the leader who ordered it has already shown himself to be vindictive in many other ways.
You might consider that if the crime were serious enough, then perhaps a public execution could not only serve as a deterent for future crimes, but also as catharsis for the family and friends of the victims.
But, that is not the case, here. The leader is mad with power and he gets a kick out of riling the world with spectacle.
I would watch so that I may see with my own eyes where the world is at, so that I will not need to rely on second hand news to tell me whether I should feel concerned or, later, whether the thing even happened.
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u/user0987234 Christian 1d ago
I’m not connecting the points you are making to watching a public execution.
It seems to be Americanized approach to justify watching a public execution.
If anything, I expected no-one to watch. Watching gives the administration a sense that their actions are condoned. Viewership numbers will be manipulated and promoted.
And be further concerned that executions may be held as examples for other “crimes” against the state, be it a political or religious disagreements.
Too many times Americans have convinced themselves that checks and balances work. Doesn’t seem to be working when looking at it from the outside.
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u/tremble_lip Christian 15h ago
I understand your point about how watching could be (and likely would be) taken as public support and could be used as evidence to justify more. It's a very good point; smother the flame with disinterest. Deprive the spectacle of attention and it snuffs itself out.
However, that is a social decision based on group unity toward a common goal.
I was thinking of it more so from the perspective of personal morality. Would it be immoral to watch, (regardless of how the views may be interpreted in political terms)?
I phrased it as something like a moral obligation to watch because not doing so could be like turning away from a problem.
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u/user0987234 Christian 12h ago
I’ll have to ponder this some more. I find the “moral obligation” to watch extremely problematic.
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u/tremble_lip Christian 11h ago
Yes it's a tricky one, almost like there is no one right answer for all people. It's right or wrong based on how the individual reached that conclusion, perhaps. 🙃
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u/user0987234 Christian 5h ago
Like most things, that can be the case.
Forcing oneself to watch a firing squad though, that you were not directly connected to a victim? Can’t get my head wrapped around that.
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u/Creepy_Mammoth_7076 Christian (non-denominational) 2d ago
Comparing executions in North Korea to the lawful execution of a convicted terrorist under the Uniform Code of Military Justice is a false equivalence. These are NOT the same thing.
Nidal Hasan was a Major in the United States Army, a psychiatrist. A man entrusted with the care of our service members. He had a DUTY to protect life, not take it! Instead he murdered 13 people and wounded dozens more. He betrayed his oath, his uniform and the very people he was sworn to serve.
Understand something, God did not give governing authorities the sword for decoration. Romans 13:4 tells us they do not bear the sword in vain. Justice is not bloodlust, punishment is not inherently cruelty. I support the death penalty because evil deserves punishment and God has given governing authorities the responsibility to administer justice.
Whether I watch this execution or not changes absolutely NOTHING about whether justice is being served.
And understand this also, Nidal Hasan’s time on this earth is limited, just like yours and mine. My prayer is that he repents, rejects the false god allah and places his full faith in Jesus Christ, fully God and fully man. So that when he stands before the Throne of Grace to give an account for his life, he is met with grace and not judgement. Because apart from Christ there is no salvation.
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u/TinySnorlax123 Lutheran 2d ago
I don't know which execution you're talking about but I don't think it's inherently bad to watch executions.
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u/JohnnyO1989 Christian, Evangelical 2d ago
I don’t have an issue with it. I wouldn’t seek out watching it, but if watching an execution could prevent even one person from committing a future crime because they are fearful of the punishment, it would be a positive. I think it’s common sense to understand that seeing something happen feels more real than just hearing about something happen.
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u/Recent_Weather2228 Christian, Calvinist 2d ago
This is something that North Korea does.
This is something that basically every society on earth has done until very recently. The US performed public executions until the 40s. Nothing about public executions is limited to dictatorships.
The death penalty is necessary for a just society. It is unjust to allow those who intentionally destroy innocent life to remain alive. It is better to be honest with ourselves about what justice is and what it looks like than to pretend that bad people don't exist and we don't have to have anything to do with their punishment.
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u/ehbowen Southern Baptist 2d ago
Yes, and it should be. I believe that, when execution is called for by a heinous crime and due process of law and conviction, it should be both prompt, and public.
I prefer the full-on True Grit treatment: Scaffold, nooses, a preacher leading "Amazing Grace," and all of the townspeople watching. It might inspire a couple of them to think twice before their next drunken outburst.
Think of it from the conspiracy theorist standpoint: These executions which take place in blacked-out compartments with no witnesses...how do you know the criminal is even dead? Maybe he's hanging out on a beach with Epstein, somewhere....
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2d ago
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u/Fanghur1123 Agnostic 2d ago
Ah yes, because MMA is morally equivalent to a state-sanctioned snuff stream...
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u/Illustrious-Ant8888 Christian 2d ago
Absolutely not.